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DeepSeek v4

api-docs.deepseek.com

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Re: DeepSeek v4

#171

Post by zozbot234 »

simonw wrote: post #85
inventor7777 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weren't there some frameworks recently released to allow Macs to stream weights from fast SSDs and thus fit way more parameters than what would normally fit in RAM? I have never tried one yet but I am considering trying that for a medium sized model.

I've been calling that the "streaming experts" trick, the key idea is to take advantage of Mixture of Expert models where only a subset of the weights are used for each round of calculations, then load those weights from SSD into RAM for each round. As I understand it if DeepSeek v4 Pro is a 1.6T, 49B active that means you'd need just 49B in memory, so ~100GB at 16 bit or ~50GB at 8bit quantized. v4 Flash is 284B, 13…

The "active" count is not very meaningful except as a broad measure of sparsity, since the experts in MoE models are chosen per layer. Once you're streaming experts from disk, there's nothing that inherently requires having 49B parameters in memory at once. Of course, the less caching memory does, the higher the performance overhead of fetching from disk.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#172

Post by throwa356262 »

raincole wrote: post #49
sbysb wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's difficult because even if the underlying model is very good, not having a pre-built harness like Claude Code makes it very un-sticky for most devs. Even at equal quality, the friction (or at least perceived friction) is higher than the mainstream models.

OpenCode? Pi? If one finds it difficult to set up OpenCode to use whatever providers they want, I won't call them 'dev'. The only real friction ( if the model is actually as good as SOTA) is to convince your employer to pay for it. But again if it really provides the same value at a fraction of the cost, it'll eventually cease to be an issue.

    "If one finds it difficult to set up OpenCode to use whatever providers they want, I won't call them 'dev'."
I feel the same way. But look at the ollama vs llama.cpp post from HN few days back and you will see most of the enthusiasts in this space are very non technical people.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#173

Post by xnx »

Such different time now than early 2025 when people thought Deepaeek was going to kill the market for Nvidia.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#174

Post by nsoonhui »

simonw wrote: post #63

I like the pelican I got out of deepseek-v4-flash more than the one I got from deepseek-v4-pro. https://simonwillison.net/2026/Apr/24/deepseek-v4/ Both generated using OpenRouter. For comparison, here's what I got from DeepSeek 3.2 back in December: https://simonwillison.net/2025/Dec/1/deepseek-v32/ And DeepSeek 3.1 in August: https://simonwillison.net/2025/Aug/22/deepseek-31/ And DeepSeek v3-0324 in March last year:…

To me this is the perfect proof that

1) LLM is not AGI. Because surely if AGI it would imply that pro would do better than flash?

2) and because of the above, Pelican example is most likely already being benchmaxxed.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#175

Post by EnPissant »

simonw wrote: post #68
ls612 wrote: post #28

How long does it usually take for folks to make smaller distills of these models? I really want to see how this will do when brought down to a size that will run on a Macbook.

Unsloth often turn them around within a few hours, they might have gone to bed already though! Keep an eye on https://huggingface.co/unsloth/models Update ten minutes later: https://huggingface.co/unsloth/DeepSeek-V4-Pro just appeared but doesn't have files in yet, so they are clearly awake and pushing updates.

Those are quants, not distills.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#176

Post by libraryofbabel »

greenknight wrote: post #24
onchainintel wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does it compare to Opus 4.7? I've been immersed in 4.7 all week participating in the Anthropic Opus 4.7 hackathon and it's pretty impressive even if it's ravenous from a token perspective compared to 4.6

The thing is, it doesnt need to beat 4.7. it just needs to do somewhat well against it. This is free... as in you can download it, run it on your systems and finetune it to be the way you want it to be.

> you can download it, run it on your systems

In theory, sure, but as other have pointed out you need to spend half a million on GPUs just to get enough VRAM to fit a single instance of the model. And you’d better make sure your use case makes full 24/7 use of all that rapidly-depreciating hardware you just spent all your money on, otherwise your actual cost per token will be much higher than you think.

In practice you will get better value from just buying tokens from a third party whose business is hosting open weight models as efficiently as possible and who make full use of their hardware. Even with the small margin they charge on top you will still come out ahead.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#177

Post by chvid »

simonw wrote: post #63

I like the pelican I got out of deepseek-v4-flash more than the one I got from deepseek-v4-pro. https://simonwillison.net/2026/Apr/24/deepseek-v4/ Both generated using OpenRouter. For comparison, here's what I got from DeepSeek 3.2 back in December: https://simonwillison.net/2025/Dec/1/deepseek-v32/ And DeepSeek 3.1 in August: https://simonwillison.net/2025/Aug/22/deepseek-31/ And DeepSeek v3-0324 in March last year:…

Is it then Deepseek hosted by Deepseek?

How much does the drawing change if you ask it again?

Re: DeepSeek v4

#178

Post by sandGorgon »

0xbadcafebee wrote: post #70
nthypes wrote: post #5

https://huggingface.co/deepseek-ai/DeepSeek-V4-Pro/blob/main... Model was released and it's amazing. Frontier level (better than Opus 4.6) at a fraction of the cost.

I don't think we need to compare models to Opus anymore. Opus users don't care about other models, as they're convinced Opus will be better forever. And non-Opus users don't want the expense, lock-in or limits. As a non-Opus user, I'll continue to use the cheapest fastest models that get my job done, which (for me anyway) is still MiniMax M2.5. I occasionally try a newer, more expensive model, and I get the same resu…

actually this is not the reason - the harness is significantly better. There is no comparable harness to Claude Code with skills, etc.

Opencode was getting there, but it seems the founders lost interest. Pi could be it, but its very focused on OpenClaw. Even Codex cli doesnt have all of it.

which harness works well with Deepseek v4 ?

Re: DeepSeek v4

#179

Post by mohsen1 »

simonw wrote: post #68
ls612 wrote: post #28

How long does it usually take for folks to make smaller distills of these models? I really want to see how this will do when brought down to a size that will run on a Macbook.

Unsloth often turn them around within a few hours, they might have gone to bed already though! Keep an eye on https://huggingface.co/unsloth/models Update ten minutes later: https://huggingface.co/unsloth/DeepSeek-V4-Pro just appeared but doesn't have files in yet, so they are clearly awake and pushing updates.

"2 minutes ago" https://huggingface.co/unsloth/DeepSeek-V4-Pro

Re: DeepSeek v4

#180

Post by chronogram »

JSR_FDED wrote: post #67
simonw wrote: post #63

I like the pelican I got out of deepseek-v4-flash more than the one I got from deepseek-v4-pro. https://simonwillison.net/2026/Apr/24/deepseek-v4/ Both generated using OpenRouter. For comparison, here's what I got from DeepSeek 3.2 back in December: https://simonwillison.net/2025/Dec/1/deepseek-v32/ And DeepSeek 3.1 in August: https://simonwillison.net/2025/Aug/22/deepseek-31/ And DeepSeek v3-0324 in March last year:…

No way. The Pro pelican is fatter, has a customized front fork, and the sun is shining! He’s definitely living the best life.

The pro pelican is a work of art! It goes dimensions that no other LLM has gone before.
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