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MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

craigmod.com

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Re: MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

#31

Post by benoau »

troupo wrote: post #24
benoau wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think there’s just a kind of techie who desperately wishes they could do everything on an iPad I think if the hardware differences really mattered Sidecar wouldn't exist, Mac wouldn't run iOS apps, iPhone wouldn't stream to Mac, and the AVP wouldn't stream/run apps from both platforms. Would those devices be better if their software was strictly siloed from each other?

> Would those devices be better if their software was strictly siloed from each other? Yes, yes they would. You would get software actually designed to fully exploit the capabilities of the device. And not, for example, shitty lazy port of mobile apps to MacOS

> You would get software actually designed to fully exploit the capabilities of the device.

Or you would just have a void where that hypothetical software could be, and this is what actually happened to the iPad (and AVP).

Re: MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

#33

Post by tomaskafka »

cyberpunk wrote: post #25
tomaskafka wrote: post #15

I sign this essay. Apple has apparently multiple opposing goals for the iPadOS: 1. Make it powerful enough so that it can be sold as equivalent to macOS 2. Keep it locked like iOS, to be sold as secure alternative to computer for your parents and kids (which rules out all the workflow customization pros need) 3. Don’t make it powerful enough for people to stop buying Macs (Tim Cook’s biggest fear is of you not buying…

It’s got a bunch of decent ssh clients; I use mine quite often for this. With a hdmi capture thingy it’s also the display for a bunch of my rpis when they don’t boot etc.. Totally doable for travel debugging.

Yes, but what I meant was to have an IDE, where I could run and debug the stack, and deploy when happy.

Technically totally doable, just give me a VS Code + local Linux container (Apple Silicon is great at virtualization) to which it can tunnel.

In practice, impossible with Apple's limitations.

Re: MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

#34

Post by reacharavindh »

The part that makes ipadOS feels like a toy is Apple’s iron grip in “App Store only” app delivery. The thing has so much power, but to do anything useful, you gotta play by Apple’s rules. All that dream of quirky, useful, innovative ipadOS leveraging apps would show up if they relinquished that software control and let indie or otherwise apps get there without the Apple Tax both in money and rules.

Would the iPad still be that days long, cohesive device is another story.. it Apple cannot have their cake and eat it too.

Re: MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

#35

Post by tomaskafka »

nicbou wrote: post #19
tomaskafka wrote: post #15

I sign this essay. Apple has apparently multiple opposing goals for the iPadOS: 1. Make it powerful enough so that it can be sold as equivalent to macOS 2. Keep it locked like iOS, to be sold as secure alternative to computer for your parents and kids (which rules out all the workflow customization pros need) 3. Don’t make it powerful enough for people to stop buying Macs (Tim Cook’s biggest fear is of you not buying…

The iPad is really good for digital art.

Neither I, nor Craig has any issue with that :).

Re: MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

#36

Post by elboru »

hbbio wrote: post #17

The elephant in the room is something else. iPhones need desktop mode. Your apps, your data. USB-C screen + Bluetooth keyboard/mouse. Running like iPadOS or even macOS.

Back in 2011, when Motorola released a phone that could do something similar, I was sure that was going to be the future. It’s been 15 years.

I still dream of the day when my computer lives on my wrist, and I just have a few dummy screens in different formats that can connect to it so I can consume media or be productive.

Re: MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

#37

Post by steveBK123 »

christophilus wrote: post #30
steveBK123 wrote: post #21

I've used Mac for 20 years and iPad on&off for 10 years.. largely I agree with Craig. Touch on MacOS is basically useless, you won't realize this until you try using an iPad like a MacBook for an extended period of time. Reaching up from keyboard/trackpad to touch the screen quickly gets fatiguing. It is not ergonomic. The iPad is meant to be used in touch mode while in your hands generally. If they were brave they'd…

This is why I’ve never understood the demand for a touchscreen on a laptop. All of my non-Mac laptops have touchscreens, and I basically never use the touch feature except by accident (e.g. a kid pointing and asking a question and causing some code to highlight).

I think the best use cases of iPad are basically bifurcated into:

1) Consumption device People reading, scrolling, watching videos. Nice on the sofa, in bed, whatever. Also this use case has a lot of older users driven by eyesight issues that make a bigger slightly further screen interface better. Also very intuitive to young children (funny how often this elderly/youth overlap rears its head).

2) Creative (not productivity/coding!) device Artists needing pencil & touch interface for precise tactile writing/drawing/editing

Re: MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

#38

Post by cguess »

latexr wrote: post #29
commieneko wrote: post #23

This person nails it. The part about Procreate is really spot on. If you draw on the iPad, and I do, Procreate just dissolves under your fingers and pencil. It's like working with paper and pencil. Almost. And it has Undo. Tactile feedback would be nice, but I'm not sure what that means. Paper and pencil has great tactile feedback. Trying to describe it with words is an exercise in frustration. If you don't draw, or…

> Tactile feedback would be nice, but I'm not sure what that means. Modern Mac trackpads don’t really click, they vibrate upon sensing a certain amount of force, and the sensory illusion is good enough to be indistinguishable from the real thing. I’m only suggesting this tongue-in-cheek, but perhaps there’ll come a time when the Apple Pencil can micro-vibrate in such a way that is so convincing it will make you feel…

The Neo does have true tactile feedback, but you're correct for the other MacBooks.

Re: MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

#39

Post by afavour »

reacharavindh wrote: post #34

The part that makes ipadOS feels like a toy is Apple’s iron grip in “App Store only” app delivery. The thing has so much power, but to do anything useful, you gotta play by Apple’s rules. All that dream of quirky, useful, innovative ipadOS leveraging apps would show up if they relinquished that software control and let indie or otherwise apps get there without the Apple Tax both in money and rules. Would the iPad sti…

I disagree. Don’t get me wrong, I want Apple to open up devices like the iPad. But I can think of few apps that would transform the iPad from “toy” to “serious” that are blocked by the policy. That transformation is largely blocked by the OS UI.

Re: MacBook Neo and how the iPad should be

#40

Post by benoau »

elboru wrote: post #36
hbbio wrote: post #17

The elephant in the room is something else. iPhones need desktop mode. Your apps, your data. USB-C screen + Bluetooth keyboard/mouse. Running like iPadOS or even macOS.

Back in 2011, when Motorola released a phone that could do something similar, I was sure that was going to be the future. It’s been 15 years. I still dream of the day when my computer lives on my wrist, and I just have a few dummy screens in different formats that can connect to it so I can consume media or be productive.

It's starting to realize now though, USB-C providing power and display, emulation allowing for x86 software. We're not far away from a Steam/Proton type scenario where you just run whatever you want on your phone's desktop mode, the most powerful Android phones are already doing this!
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