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EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

reuters.com

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Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#51

Post by measurablefunc »

ManuelKiessling wrote: post #39
measurablefunc wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not making any political statements, it's all basic physics & material science: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEkIh2PcSYE

Global copper reserves are about 980 million tonnes, with 1.5 billion tonnes of identified resources and 2024 mine production of about 23 million tonnes. A conventional car uses about 23 kg of copper and a battery-electric car about 83 kg, a difference of roughly 60 kg per vehicle. With more than 17 million EVs sold in 2024, that implies about 1.4 million tonnes of copper embodied in those vehicles, or about 1.0 mill…

Great, do these reports include all the other materials that go into BEV b/c copper is only one single component w/ a shortfall.

Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#52

Post by measurablefunc »

vel0city wrote: post #50
measurablefunc wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've convinced me, the data you have presented definitely makes it clear & obvious that Mark Mills is wrong & you are right.

But this guy says 9 out of 10 doctors prefer Camels! Mark Mills is essentially the same as those researchers who told you cigarettes don't cause cancer and lead in the gas isn't anything to worry about.

I didn't really ask for analogies & metaphors but you spent a lot of time not doing any of the math. It's a good thing I found your argument convincing though, now everyone else can look at this thread & convince themselves that EVs are viable b/c you presented very coherent evidence & arguments.

Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#53

Post by vel0city »

measurablefunc wrote: post #52
vel0city wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But this guy says 9 out of 10 doctors prefer Camels! Mark Mills is essentially the same as those researchers who told you cigarettes don't cause cancer and lead in the gas isn't anything to worry about.

I didn't really ask for analogies & metaphors but you spent a lot of time not doing any of the math. It's a good thing I found your argument convincing though, now everyone else can look at this thread & convince themselves that EVs are viable b/c you presented very coherent evidence & arguments.

> but you spent a lot of time not doing any of the math

I actually did the math two hours ago in the other comment showing your point about copper is nonsensical.

Strange the oil man is so concerned about a recycleable metal that an EV uses 200lbs or less of compared to the 48,000lbs a similar ICE will burn in gas. Doesn't bother thinking about all the extraction issues with that or how that will be a finite supply.

Hilarious.

But sure, take the words of a guy paid millions to lie to you about this very topic who gave you no data at all over the actual data I gave below.

Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#54

Post by vel0city »

measurablefunc wrote: post #51
ManuelKiessling wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Global copper reserves are about 980 million tonnes, with 1.5 billion tonnes of identified resources and 2024 mine production of about 23 million tonnes. A conventional car uses about 23 kg of copper and a battery-electric car about 83 kg, a difference of roughly 60 kg per vehicle. With more than 17 million EVs sold in 2024, that implies about 1.4 million tonnes of copper embodied in those vehicles, or about 1.0 mill…

Great, do these reports include all the other materials that go into BEV b/c copper is only one single component w/ a shortfall.

And the goalposts go flying!

You know what's a shortfall today around the world? Gasoline.

Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#55

Post by smithoc »

melling wrote: post #34
a_shovel wrote: post #25

The next administration needs to mandate the big American auto companies produce more EVs in more models in order to save them from the irrelevance they seemingly desire and arguably deserve.

You’re part of the problem, not the solution. There’s an entire political backlash against EVs because of mandates. The Trump Administration actually prevented California from having EV quotas. Simply let in EVs from China and let American car companies go out of business.

There's a political backlash because Fox News and some Russian propaganda social media accounts told people to get angry and they did.

We have mandates against leaded fuel and excessively tinted windows and for child seats. We have mandates for airbags and seatbelts and bumper heights and crumple zones and turn signals.

EVs are better than gas cars in every way - less noise, less pollution, less dependency buying oil from the Middle East. Our policies, regulations and incentive structures should mirror that.

Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#56

Post by melling »

smithoc wrote: post #55
melling wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re part of the problem, not the solution. There’s an entire political backlash against EVs because of mandates. The Trump Administration actually prevented California from having EV quotas. Simply let in EVs from China and let American car companies go out of business.

There's a political backlash because Fox News and some Russian propaganda social media accounts told people to get angry and they did. We have mandates against leaded fuel and excessively tinted windows and for child seats. We have mandates for airbags and seatbelts and bumper heights and crumple zones and turn signals. EVs are better than gas cars in every way - less noise, less pollution, less dependency buying oil…

If they’re better, you don’t need mandates.

Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#57

Post by [deleted] »

measurablefunc wrote: post #33
peterlada wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Geez, Hillsdale College. Worldwide authority on all economics from the theological perspective. Congrats on picking information sources.

Do the math & then post your own video to explain why he's mistaken.

[deleted]

Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#58

Post by SapporoChris »

melling wrote: post #56
smithoc wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a political backlash because Fox News and some Russian propaganda social media accounts told people to get angry and they did. We have mandates against leaded fuel and excessively tinted windows and for child seats. We have mandates for airbags and seatbelts and bumper heights and crumple zones and turn signals. EVs are better than gas cars in every way - less noise, less pollution, less dependency buying oil…

If they’re better, you don’t need mandates.

Sad to say, the best does not always win. There are countless examples in technology, products, politics, etc etc.

Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#59

Post by melling »

SapporoChris wrote: post #58
melling wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they’re better, you don’t need mandates.

Sad to say, the best does not always win. There are countless examples in technology, products, politics, etc etc.

Fortunately EVs are also cheaper. Unfortunately, the US has a 100% tariff on the less expensive Chinese EVs and batteries.

Better and cheaper does win.

Re: EV sales soar in main European markets as drivers shun expensive petrol

#60

Post by measurablefunc »

vel0city wrote: post #54
measurablefunc wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great, do these reports include all the other materials that go into BEV b/c copper is only one single component w/ a shortfall.

And the goalposts go flying! You know what's a shortfall today around the world? Gasoline.

Peak oil production was in 1970 so I don't know what to tell you other than it's basic physics. You should look into something called EROEI (energy return on energy invested). You might find it useful for your next argument about the viability of EVs.
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