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All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

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Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#131

Post by t0mas88 »

mentalgear wrote: post #58

I was looking forward to finally be able to easily switch out (i)Phone batteries again - after 20 years - but turns out the lobbyists managed to get a loophole in the law - exempting Apple & Co from making their phones more repairable / longer live-able. > If a battery can do 1000 cycles and remain above 80% capacity it is exempt

My iPhone 14 is 1081 days old, charged every night, battery capacity is reported as 81%. So in Apple's own measurements this is possible.

I guess there is some built in spare capacity, but that may still qualify for the exemption?

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#132

Post by cptskippy »

lsxr wrote: post #108
kjkjadksj wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No shot at all apple batteries can last 1000 cycles and remain above 80% capacity. Probably can’t even do 300 in my experience. Sounds like an easy lawsuit.

No doubt they will redefine maximum battery capacity to a figure that does achieve 80% over 1000 cycles. If you under-declare maximum capacity then there is a lot of headroom for actual degradation before you start to show degradation to the user.

This is what they should have been doing all along. My Pixel tells me that charging above 80% is bad for battery longevity and I should set a charge limit. Well then maybe 80% should be the new 100% and the advertised capacity should be the 80%.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#133

Post by protimewaster »

nslsm wrote: post #112
kjkjadksj wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No shot at all apple batteries can last 1000 cycles and remain above 80% capacity. Probably can’t even do 300 in my experience. Sounds like an easy lawsuit.

In the meantime, my daily driver here in reality land: https://i.imgur.com/8yEEJVb.png

That has not been my experience, at least with Apple laptops. Even when rated for 1000 cycles, I'll get the warning that service is needed (AFAIK that means 80% capacity or lower) well before then. I've seen this on several, but the one I just checked is at just under 670 cycles and has had that warning up for some months already.

Maybe iPhones are better about this, though, I don't know. But I definitely don't have a lot of faith in the laptops maintaining 80% for 1000 cycles.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#134

Post by ricardobayes »

999900000999 wrote: post #9

>The regulation states that batteries must be removable using ‘commercially available’ tools This is doing a lot of work here. There's enough wiggle room for this to be absolutely meaningless. Anything short of I can slide off the back cover and maybe unscrew two or three screws to replace the battery means that a lot of people are going to end up not being able to replace the batteries.

That reads true. While replaceability is definitely a good thing, but whether it will end up being a good thing for the average user (and not lead to some further price hikes in the EU market) remains to be seen.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#135

Post by LeonidasXIV »

mschuster91 wrote: post #6
twilo wrote: post #4

If a battery can do 1000 cycles and remain above 80% capacity it is exempt from this, which is exactly what Apple implemented a few years ago. Low cost phones will be most affected.

> Low cost phones will be most affected. Not really. Take a 4000 mAh rated cell, advertise it as "rated for 3500 mAh" and that's it.

Isn't this pretty much what Nothing are doing? At least one of their phones has a different battery rating in India than elsewhere, despite containing the same hardware.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#136

Post by [deleted] »

lsxr wrote: post #108
kjkjadksj wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No shot at all apple batteries can last 1000 cycles and remain above 80% capacity. Probably can’t even do 300 in my experience. Sounds like an easy lawsuit.

No doubt they will redefine maximum battery capacity to a figure that does achieve 80% over 1000 cycles. If you under-declare maximum capacity then there is a lot of headroom for actual degradation before you start to show degradation to the user.

[deleted]

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#137

Post by OutOfHere »

konschubert wrote: post #120

Aren't today's phone batteries already replaceable with commercially available tools? I can walk into a non-apple store with my iPhone and walk out with a replaced battery 20 minutes later. This isn't even what drives obsolesce of phones, it's software updates. If you really want to be able to self-swap your own battery, you can just buy an Android that has a replaceable battery. Do we need to regulate something that…

People shouldn't have to go to a special store or buy special tools requiring special skills to change a battery.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#138

Post by dathinab »

darkwater wrote: post #18
thaumasiotes wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Batteries have been used as part of planned obsol[esc]ence for too long and a whole small business industry of replacing phone batteries has appeared because of it. Note that early phones had replaceable batteries and it was later phones that dropped that feature. The idea wasn't that making the phone impossible to open would compel people to replace their phone faster; it was that given that people didn't keep the…

That was true 15-20 years ago. Nowadays changing the phone is basically because: 1) battery dying / not lasting enough 2) shattered glasses whose replacement costs 35-40% of the cost of the phone new (for budget/mid-range phones, not everybody has iPhones) distant 3rd) not enough free internal storage

also camera just not being satisfying enough anymore is a big deal

sure on highest end phones you have very good cameras since a long time by now, but even there they find improvements here and there (e.g. zoom, low light pictures, even better image stabilization)

but middle to lower end phones are still have major improvements in every generation of a certain brand/line/price category. And you might be satisfied with a "acceptable" quality camera, until everyone around you has way nicer photos, or you now have a reason to make photes you didn't had in the past, or you get older and your hands a bit unsteady etc.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#139

Post by nonethewiser »

mentalgear wrote: post #58

I was looking forward to finally be able to easily switch out (i)Phone batteries again - after 20 years - but turns out the lobbyists managed to get a loophole in the law - exempting Apple & Co from making their phones more repairable / longer live-able. > If a battery can do 1000 cycles and remain above 80% capacity it is exempt

Seems entirely reasonable. Embedded batteries have a lot of advantages. Cheaper, higher battery capacity, water proof, smaller, stronger. I think this will largely just make the mid to low tier android market in the EU shittier.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#140

Post by floatrock »

lsxr wrote: post #108
kjkjadksj wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No shot at all apple batteries can last 1000 cycles and remain above 80% capacity. Probably can’t even do 300 in my experience. Sounds like an easy lawsuit.

No doubt they will redefine maximum battery capacity to a figure that does achieve 80% over 1000 cycles. If you under-declare maximum capacity then there is a lot of headroom for actual degradation before you start to show degradation to the user.

iPhone 17 Pro launch specs:

> Video Playback: Up to 27* hours

> *: 25 hours in the EU

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