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Sauna effect on heart rate

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Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#61

Post by shevy-java »

Well ...

Finland life expectancy for 2023 was 81.69.

Norway life expectancy for 2025 was 83.23.

Japan life expectancy for 2025 was 85.27.

Sumo wrestlers in Japan have a life expectancy between 60-65 years or so - significantly lower than the other japanese.

I am not saying that sauna has no positive effect at all, but I would reason that the number one risk factor is ... weight. And I'd also still say that exercise is correlated here, if only secondary, e. g. you may be able to maintain better bodily functions if you exercise, if you can avoid injury. I do not think that going into the sauna rather than e. g. light running for 5 to 10 minutes or so, is anywhere near on the same level.

Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#62

Post by adrianN »

mminer237 wrote: post #40
nsbk wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently listened to a podcast about the benefits of sauna or deliberate heat exposure and the gist is that if you get your core temperature at about 39 degrees celsius your cardiovascular system is working comparably hard to light exercise. My take is that your heart and lungs are working out, even if your body is not. Do you get the same benefits as going for a run or bike ride for a comparable amount of time? no…

Edit: I posted this accidentally when editing without noticing. Hypertrophy isn't necessarily a bad thing. I thought I was discarding the comment cuz I realized I was out of my depth. whoops Please ignore my comment, though I will leave it to make the below comments less confusing. Original: You don't want to "work out" your heart though. Cardiac hypertrophy is a bad thing. The benefit of exercise is that your muscle…

Wikipedia says Athlete's heart is benign: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athletic_heart_syndrome

Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#63

Post by kiritanpo »

mminer237 wrote: post #40
nsbk wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently listened to a podcast about the benefits of sauna or deliberate heat exposure and the gist is that if you get your core temperature at about 39 degrees celsius your cardiovascular system is working comparably hard to light exercise. My take is that your heart and lungs are working out, even if your body is not. Do you get the same benefits as going for a run or bike ride for a comparable amount of time? no…

Edit: I posted this accidentally when editing without noticing. Hypertrophy isn't necessarily a bad thing. I thought I was discarding the comment cuz I realized I was out of my depth. whoops Please ignore my comment, though I will leave it to make the below comments less confusing. Original: You don't want to "work out" your heart though. Cardiac hypertrophy is a bad thing. The benefit of exercise is that your muscle…

Cardiac hypertrophy is not necessarily a bad thing, it can be the result of positive adaptation, such as exercising.

Eccentric hypertrophy (athlete's heart) is the positive adaptation resulting from training the heart. The heart has a lower resting rate and is more efficient at pumping blood. It returns to normal size if training stops.

You'll never reach a state of hypertrophic cardiomyopathy (the bad kind of hypertrophy) with exercise. Its cause is usually genetic.

Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#64

Post by shevy-java »

bluGill wrote: post #52
ricardobayes wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My take is probably too nuanced here, but the reality is that we don't know. People living in areas with longevity (blue zones), didn't really excercise (as in sports) or take multivitamins. For all we know, it might even come out that regular, gym-style excercise is even worse for longevity. Nordic people tend to live a long life even though they historically didn't have access to fresh vegetables or fruit and bruta…

Problem is sauna use and genetic factors corrolate too strongly to make any conclusion to the broader population. If you live in/near Finland you likely sauna often, as have all your ancestors for thousands of years. If you don't live there both are false. Thus we can't know if Sauna is helpful for the general population who isn't of a Finish background.

Japan has a +4 years lead of life expectancy over Finland; Norway almost +3 years on Finland. I am not saying this is conclusive per se, but to me the sauna-people-live-forever is not backed up by the data. I would instead reason that, e. g. weight correlates a lot more here.

Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#65

Post by jagged-chisel »

mminer237 wrote: post #40
nsbk wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently listened to a podcast about the benefits of sauna or deliberate heat exposure and the gist is that if you get your core temperature at about 39 degrees celsius your cardiovascular system is working comparably hard to light exercise. My take is that your heart and lungs are working out, even if your body is not. Do you get the same benefits as going for a run or bike ride for a comparable amount of time? no…

Edit: I posted this accidentally when editing without noticing. Hypertrophy isn't necessarily a bad thing. I thought I was discarding the comment cuz I realized I was out of my depth. whoops Please ignore my comment, though I will leave it to make the below comments less confusing. Original: You don't want to "work out" your heart though. Cardiac hypertrophy is a bad thing. The benefit of exercise is that your muscle…

Your heart is also a muscle.

Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#66

Post by iammjm »

nyjah wrote: post #42
bluGill wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most important thing you didn't measure: does this affect long term health in the same way exercise it known to. That is can I put a TV in my sauna and watch that for an hour every day instead of getting out and exercising - yet get the same better long term health outcomes? My current guess is no. That is this improves a marker for good health without improving health. However this is a guess by someone who isn'…

Zero shot you'd make it an hour in a proper sauna for an hour. People have this idea that saunas are always enjoyable. I sauna daily, and its nice up to a point. For me thats like 10-12mins in. From then on, its tough.

I go for 15 min sessions at 90 Celsius and the first 10 mins are ok, the last 5 are tough, like I have to control my breath to hang in there

Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#67

Post by SJMG »

mminer237 wrote: post #40
nsbk wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently listened to a podcast about the benefits of sauna or deliberate heat exposure and the gist is that if you get your core temperature at about 39 degrees celsius your cardiovascular system is working comparably hard to light exercise. My take is that your heart and lungs are working out, even if your body is not. Do you get the same benefits as going for a run or bike ride for a comparable amount of time? no…

Edit: I posted this accidentally when editing without noticing. Hypertrophy isn't necessarily a bad thing. I thought I was discarding the comment cuz I realized I was out of my depth. whoops Please ignore my comment, though I will leave it to make the below comments less confusing. Original: You don't want to "work out" your heart though. Cardiac hypertrophy is a bad thing. The benefit of exercise is that your muscle…

This is terribly uniformed. Do not listen to this.

Cardiac hypertrophy isn't a "bad thing". This is completely contextual. What you don't want, for example, is pathological hypertrophy from things like hypertension, or exclusive left ventricular hypertrophy without associated increase in chamber size.

The heart is very complex. You 100% should exercise it.

Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#68

Post by Glemllksdf »

kyriakosel wrote: post #2

Author here. Methodology upfront because I'd ask the same things: Data: daily records from wearable users who logged sauna sessions via connected apps. Within-person design — each user is their own control, comparing their own sauna-day nights against their own non-sauna-day nights. No cross-user comparisons. Stats: paired t-tests, FDR-corrected p 0.2 threshold for "meaningful effect." Anything below d=0.2 we don't r…

Or the sauna is a relaxing thing like a happy place and that reduces heart rate?

Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#69

Post by gjulianm »

kyriakosel wrote: post #2

Author here. Methodology upfront because I'd ask the same things: Data: daily records from wearable users who logged sauna sessions via connected apps. Within-person design — each user is their own control, comparing their own sauna-day nights against their own non-sauna-day nights. No cross-user comparisons. Stats: paired t-tests, FDR-corrected p 0.2 threshold for "meaningful effect." Anything below d=0.2 we don't r…

> Effect survives controlling for activity level.

How did you control for activity level? Do you have similar BPM plots for the different situations (sauna+exercise, sauna+no exercise, no sauna + exercise, no sauna + no exercise) for a visual representation?

> minimum nighttime HR drops ~3 bpm (~5%)

What wearables were used? These devices don't usually have enough precision to reliably detect ~3bpm changes. Also, the measurements are sensitive to skin, blood flow changes and temperature. How do you know the difference doesn't come from different sensor behavior after sauna?

Re: Sauna effect on heart rate

#70

Post by trklausss »

ricardobayes wrote: post #34
bluGill wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most important thing you didn't measure: does this affect long term health in the same way exercise it known to. That is can I put a TV in my sauna and watch that for an hour every day instead of getting out and exercising - yet get the same better long term health outcomes? My current guess is no. That is this improves a marker for good health without improving health. However this is a guess by someone who isn'…

My take is probably too nuanced here, but the reality is that we don't know. People living in areas with longevity (blue zones), didn't really excercise (as in sports) or take multivitamins. For all we know, it might even come out that regular, gym-style excercise is even worse for longevity. Nordic people tend to live a long life even though they historically didn't have access to fresh vegetables or fruit and bruta…

For all we know, there is a link between cardiac/circulatory problems and arteriosclerosis (that is, loss of elasticity of the vessels).

So it could be that exercise helps keep this elasticity, the same way maybe sauna does? Also antioxidants from vegetables etc.

So it could be that it is a _factor_, but definitely needs way more study.

I am also not in the medical field, but I think arteriosclerosis is a well known link for cardiovascular disease.

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