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College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

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Re: College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

#241

Post by ZiiS »

curun1r wrote: post #229

I'm old enough to remember a similar controversy over whether to allow calculators in math classes. While most schools were banning them to force kids to learn how to do math without them, my school went the other way. They mandated that every student had one and then changed the assignments and tests to account for it. Gone were questions that had whole number answers that could be computed in our heads. Instead, an…

The difference is you learned useful maths teaching your calculator. At the moment a teacher can't tell if you even read the LLM output. Even if all future literature is writen with an LLM it is highly likely the are skills you need to learn to become a best selling author.

Re: College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

#242

Post by amtamt »

curun1r wrote: post #229

I'm old enough to remember a similar controversy over whether to allow calculators in math classes. While most schools were banning them to force kids to learn how to do math without them, my school went the other way. They mandated that every student had one and then changed the assignments and tests to account for it. Gone were questions that had whole number answers that could be computed in our heads. Instead, an…

> Rather than banning the use of AI and trying to catch students who are cheating, why aren't they creating schoolwork that requires AI?

That is way to high recurring cost that many won't be able to afford. One could get a second hand calculator or even computer, and then additional resources needed was one's willingness. With mandating AI usage, we'd only increase the gap of haves and have-nots. I personally do not like the idea.

Re: College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

#243

Post by fph »

sdevonoes wrote: post #232
curun1r wrote: post #229

I'm old enough to remember a similar controversy over whether to allow calculators in math classes. While most schools were banning them to force kids to learn how to do math without them, my school went the other way. They mandated that every student had one and then changed the assignments and tests to account for it. Gone were questions that had whole number answers that could be computed in our heads. Instead, an…

There’s one significant difference between: typewriters and calculators are a one-time-paymeny device. LLMs are subscription based baked by billionaire companies. That alone leaves LLMs in a bad enough place

You have a point, but it is very ironic that this sounds a lot like the old argument "you must still learn to compute by hand because you won't have a calculator with you all the time".

Re: College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

#244

Post by madrox »

amtamt wrote: post #242
curun1r wrote: post #229

I'm old enough to remember a similar controversy over whether to allow calculators in math classes. While most schools were banning them to force kids to learn how to do math without them, my school went the other way. They mandated that every student had one and then changed the assignments and tests to account for it. Gone were questions that had whole number answers that could be computed in our heads. Instead, an…

> Rather than banning the use of AI and trying to catch students who are cheating, why aren't they creating schoolwork that requires AI? That is way to high recurring cost that many won't be able to afford. One could get a second hand calculator or even computer, and then additional resources needed was one's willingness. With mandating AI usage, we'd only increase the gap of haves and have-nots. I personally do not…

This is probably the fairest counter argument I’ve heard. One can hope that today’s AI will eventually be as cheap as a calculator, though.

Re: College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

#245

Post by SirHumphrey »

tim-projects wrote: post #236

To me this nostalgia is pointless. AI is here and it's good enough only going to get better. The classroom should be about using AI better not ignoring it. But that would require the teacher to be good at AI too. I think that's the problem here.

Just because an AI can craft a decent Japanese text doesn’t mean I can. Just because AI can write x86 assembly also doesn’t mean I can.

You don’t give first graders a calculator because they will always have one in their pocket- they end up just inputting numbers in a magic box and not learning how to do this manually which will destroy their future mathematical education. It’s about the same with AI.

Re: College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

#246

Post by tim-projects »

SirHumphrey wrote: post #245
tim-projects wrote: post #236

To me this nostalgia is pointless. AI is here and it's good enough only going to get better. The classroom should be about using AI better not ignoring it. But that would require the teacher to be good at AI too. I think that's the problem here.

Just because an AI can craft a decent Japanese text doesn’t mean I can. Just because AI can write x86 assembly also doesn’t mean I can. You don’t give first graders a calculator because they will always have one in their pocket- they end up just inputting numbers in a magic box and not learning how to do this manually which will destroy their future mathematical education. It’s about the same with AI.

Here is a good video I watched just yesterday on how to integrate AI into a writing and thinking process.

AI is not a gun that you can't put into the hands of a child. It's a paint brush.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbHB-rzKBAs

Re: College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

#247

Post by [deleted] »

curun1r wrote: post #229

I'm old enough to remember a similar controversy over whether to allow calculators in math classes. While most schools were banning them to force kids to learn how to do math without them, my school went the other way. They mandated that every student had one and then changed the assignments and tests to account for it. Gone were questions that had whole number answers that could be computed in our heads. Instead, an…

[deleted]

Re: College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

#248

Post by prox »

oerdier wrote: post #233
curun1r wrote: post #229

I'm old enough to remember a similar controversy over whether to allow calculators in math classes. While most schools were banning them to force kids to learn how to do math without them, my school went the other way. They mandated that every student had one and then changed the assignments and tests to account for it. Gone were questions that had whole number answers that could be computed in our heads. Instead, an…

A critical difference between a calculator and an LLM is that a calculator doesn't make decisions. A calculator performs the operations you type in, nothing more. An LLM does make decisions. The human operator of the LLM needs to be able to evaluate the decisions made by the LLM. That requires education and experience beforehand. An LLM is a force multiplier only, not a replacement. It's a personal assistant to an ex…

The post yesterday about the teacher who gave students an Apple II and taught assembly was very enlightening and example of how to go forward.

Re: College instructor turns to typewriters to curb AI-written work

#249

Post by latexr »

mquander wrote: post #240
muzzleflash wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the controversial part about AI is far above the "it is a new technology so use it". When the scientific calculator was invented, people could easily know what went into its production. As in what circuitry appears in them. You knew that if you bought it, it is yours. Want to program it? Grab a book and do this. The whole package would be a fixed price. You are in control. With AI? You are not at all in contr…

Your comment is framed like "giving a student a personal AI datacenter to carry with them" is unrealistic, but in fact it is easy for anyone with access to $1000-$2000 worth of compute to download and operate exactly that for free, with performance perhaps a year behind the state of the art.

> but in fact it is easy for anyone with access to $1000-$2000 worth of compute

Even if we assume that to be true, you severely underestimate how many people that condition excludes.

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