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America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

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Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#11

Post by vrganj »

Yes, America is a declining empire, but it has nothing to do with the reasons listed.

Decades of capitalist cruelty has created a social environment so toxic it enabled a clique of conmen to rise to the top.

Now, American hard and soft power are both being dismantled at a rapid pace. Former allies and trade partners are working around the US instead of with it now. It's leadership position has been abandoned, for no good reason at all.

The internal rot is being projected onto the global stage and I don't think Americans quite understand the consequences yet.

Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#12

Post by vrganj »

suddenlybananas wrote: post #8
pm90 wrote: post #3

I was expecting a more nuanced article that talked about the “Suez Moment” in America but this is basically a (not even a good) critique of deindustrialization.

I don't quite see the Suez Crisis analogy quite working because China (the rising power) is not really involved against the US (the waning power).

China is selling the world solar panels while the US is making gas unaffordable.

Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#13

Post by 21asdffdsa12 »

Phui3ferubus wrote: post #5
pm90 wrote: post #3

I was expecting a more nuanced article that talked about the “Suez Moment” in America but this is basically a (not even a good) critique of deindustrialization.

I don't expect anything from the guy who declared self driving cars are easy, everyone is just doing it wrong, and he could do it better in a just a year; 5 years ago. The fame totally went to his head :P It is somewhat common issue for Nobel award winners, in this case the scope is limited "I am great at security and reverse engineering, that makes me an expert for anything IT related".

Nobel Nacre.. The nobelprize is hyper destructive to the scientists receiving it. Its hard to one up from there or return to your field- everyone is bombarding you with high expectations. You can only fail after you received olympic gold. Thus, as scientists inflict change on society, and society hates change, it is like a oyster, trying to protect itself from a grain of sand, wrapping it in Nacre, protecting itself from further change, by encapsulating the changing factor which remains neutered from its ability to do science.

Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#14

Post by oezi »

The article is certainly firebranding, but the core tenet strikes a valid point: how has the US lost the plot within such a short time? How did it go from the flag bearer of freedom and progress to isolationist bully that wants to invade Greenland and become best friends with Russia?

From the outside it is really hard to comprehend. Was it FoxNews that poisoned the American mind or the social media brainwashing? How can a society allow a billionaire to cut programs in Africa that saved hundreds of thousands of lives that cost pennies when compared to any military adventures.

Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#15

Post by BirAdam »

derelicta wrote: post #6

The US Empire has reached the limit of its capitalistic mode of production. Now is time for Americans to consider the next step of any industrialised capitalist society; scientific socialism. It did wonder for China, Vietnam, and many more, and it can do wonders for the American people too.

Except that America is not, and never has been, capitalist. Much like socialism or communism, capitalism has never been achieved. The closest I know any society to have come is the USA between the late 1860s and 1913. Yet, that still wasn’t a capitalist society. Half of the country was under military occupation, people were forced to segregate by law, and the USA was conquering people militarily and committing genocide in the Philippines. For capitalism to exist, people would be sacrificing in the present for investment in the future in a free market. There are no free markets, and the world operates under financialism where the future is sacrificed for the present via debt based currency and debt based capital markets. The most free market of the last 70 years has been information technology, and that is slowly changing. As it becomes regulated, the monopolies become entrenched, innovation slows, homogenization is enforced, and products undergo a diminution in quality as monopolies needn’t compete.

To this day, capitalist leaning societies outcompete socialist leaning societies. Just don’t go saying that either has ever truly existed. Socialism and capitalism are utopian fantasies. People are messy and our systems are too.

Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#16

Post by dv_dt »

vrganj wrote: post #12
suddenlybananas wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't quite see the Suez Crisis analogy quite working because China (the rising power) is not really involved against the US (the waning power).

China is selling the world solar panels while the US is making gas unaffordable.

The US passed up multiple opportunities to fund its own more foundational solar industry

Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#17

Post by direwolf20 »

oezi wrote: post #14

The article is certainly firebranding, but the core tenet strikes a valid point: how has the US lost the plot within such a short time? How did it go from the flag bearer of freedom and progress to isolationist bully that wants to invade Greenland and become best friends with Russia? From the outside it is really hard to comprehend. Was it FoxNews that poisoned the American mind or the social media brainwashing? How…

America has never been that. With everyone having access to apps like TikTok, the brainwashing stopped working as well and people can see that it isn't.

Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#18

Post by robot_jesus »

kdilner wrote: post #7

[flagged]

It’s typical to complain about AI slop that hits the front page here, but it’s worth noting that a lot of the (presumably) human-written content is slop in its own right.

This piece was some self-indulgent rambling that didn’t really have any connective threads.

Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#19

Post by direwolf20 »

stingraycharles wrote: post #9
pm90 wrote: post #3

I was expecting a more nuanced article that talked about the “Suez Moment” in America but this is basically a (not even a good) critique of deindustrialization.

Yeah it's a very short-sighted article. Taking a quote like this: > I can’t believe those who seriously try and say America’s value is in consuming. as a case against outsourcing manufacturing really doesn't understand the value that societies create when they are on the forefront of innovation. Maybe, just maybe , at a certain point physical labour is not the best way to use your working population, but instead, you…

China is at the forefront of innovation. America is not, except for financial innovation a.k.a. the best ways to get money out of people without doing actual work.

Re: America Lost the Mandate of Heaven

#20

Post by JumpCrisscross »

oezi wrote: post #14

The article is certainly firebranding, but the core tenet strikes a valid point: how has the US lost the plot within such a short time? How did it go from the flag bearer of freedom and progress to isolationist bully that wants to invade Greenland and become best friends with Russia? From the outside it is really hard to comprehend. Was it FoxNews that poisoned the American mind or the social media brainwashing? How…

> how has the US lost the plot within such a short time? How did it go from the flag bearer of freedom and progress to isolationist bully that wants to invade Greenland and become best friends with Russia?

American culture has lost its near-monopoly on optimism. We're now almost as cynical as the Europeans. (:D)

That cynicism means civic disengagement, technological doomerism and general symptoms of depression. That collectively degrades the mostly bottom-up structures we've long relied on, requiring shifts to less-efficient (and hastily cobbled together) top-down command structures.

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