Live data from Hacker News

North American English Dialects

aschmann.net

61–70 of 100 posts

Re: North American English Dialects

#61
post #58
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Local pronunciations of place names are often different from what's expected, and whether intended to be such or not, are often used as shibboleths to distinguish locals from outsiders. The examples of Couch Street (/ˈkutʃ/) in Portland, Oregon and Tchoupitoulas Street (/ˌtʃɑp.ə.ˈtuː.ləs/) in New Orleans, Louisiana come to mind in American place names.

Fartown? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fartown%2C_Huddersfield

I wasn't referring to place names that sound like dirty words (as Couch St. sounds like "Cooch"); an uncountable number of Gropecunt Lanes in England would certainly qualify. I was rather referring to place names with counterintuitive pronunciations locals are expected to know, so that outsiders are immediately clocked by pronouncing it wrong. Couch St. definitely qualifies in both categories though.

Re: North American English Dialects

#62

The title says "dialects" but most comments here are only about accents. Can people here give examples of non-standard grammar or vocabulary (that goes beyond some temporary slang or subculture words)?

'mensch' and 'schmuck' are commonly used words in NYC that are not known to people in the South, unless they have studied German (and yes I had to fight capitalizing them.)

Another example... 'they're all' is shorthand for 'they're all gone' in Pennsylvania.

Re: North American English Dialects

#63

The title says "dialects" but most comments here are only about accents. Can people here give examples of non-standard grammar or vocabulary (that goes beyond some temporary slang or subculture words)?

Biggest two I can think of are

1) AAVE's use of Copulas. In most English you form present progressive with a copula and the present participle: I am walking, I am driving, I am working. The copula contains no information on its own. In many languages, a low information word is dropped. In Spanish you say "(yo) soy Americano" meaning "(I) am American." There can be no doubt of the subject of the verb "soy" because it is inflected to match the subject, so the pronoun "yo" communicates nothing in a normal sentence and is dropped. In Russian you take the opposite tack: you say "ya Amerikanets" meaning "I (am) American)" so you drop the copula. You either need the pronoun or the verb to communicate who is American, and in this case the pronoun won. Well in AAVE you drop the copula in those present progressive sentences: "I walking," "I driving," "I working." But then there's an opportunity to put a higher information in all of these sentences: you can use "be" as a copula to express the habitual aspect. "I be walking," "I be driving," "I be working" (usually with emphasis on the "be") mean "I am in the habit of X, but don't assume that is what I am doing at this moment." Degrees can be expressed here: you can replace "be" with "stay" to get more habitual and less present. It's a trip! I'm scratching the surface here but that's a big one.

2) Related: "Needs" + past participle vs "needs" + present participle. I was working with a handyman from Colorado and he said "This sink needs sealed" or something like that. I (Northeast) would have said "this sink needs sealing." Colorado has always had over 50% of the population born outside of the state, so I don't know if that's a thing from there or from wherever his parents are from (not sure and didn't ask).

Re: North American English Dialects

#64

The title says "dialects" but most comments here are only about accents. Can people here give examples of non-standard grammar or vocabulary (that goes beyond some temporary slang or subculture words)?

'mensch' and 'schmuck' are commonly used words in NYC that are not known to people in the South, unless they have studied German (and yes I had to fight capitalizing them.) Another example... 'they're all' is shorthand for 'they're all gone' in Pennsylvania.

Never heard that second one, which part of PA? I'm Philly burbs.

Re: North American English Dialects

#66
At Microsoft TechEd in 1997 in Orlando, Florida, Microsoft bought out SeaWorld for the attendee party. I wound up getting really wet from the orca that they used to have there splashing people and met 3 other guys on the bench in same state. We went wandering around laughing and drinking. There was an Australian from NSW, New Zealander from Auckland, a French Canadian out of Ontario, and me, a fresh off the boat immigrant from Russia. I couldn't understand half of what was said! Aussie and kiwi were giving each other lots of good natured ribbing. The canuck was having fun and so was I as we got progressively more silly. One of the best parties at an industry conference I've had. Ahh the joy of dialects!

Re: North American English Dialects

#67

The title says "dialects" but most comments here are only about accents. Can people here give examples of non-standard grammar or vocabulary (that goes beyond some temporary slang or subculture words)?

There are lots of minor (and fuzzy usage) of regional vocabulary.

"pop" vs "soda" is a commonly discussed one. (Google to see maps).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_English_regional_voca...

Re: North American English Dialects

#68

Is anyone archiving these accents ? As much as I’m happy that kids now have access to YouTube, and thus can use the neutral influencer dialect, something about our culture is being erased. I grew up speaking both a neutral California accent and bits of AAVE. AAVE itself is drastically different depending on the part of the US you’re in. I can barely understand southern AAVE. NYC AAVE is much faster, but I think NYC p…

I am the type of person to notice accents a lot, one interesting thing I've noticed is how much NYC AAVE has the vowels of other NYC accents, like the stereotypical "cawfee" vowels. A lot of AAVE across the country sounds kind of like the south to my ear, but NY is one place where the local AAVE has a lot in common with other local accents.

This is even more true if you find old recordings.

Re: North American English Dialects

#69

Is anyone archiving these accents ? As much as I’m happy that kids now have access to YouTube, and thus can use the neutral influencer dialect, something about our culture is being erased. I grew up speaking both a neutral California accent and bits of AAVE. AAVE itself is drastically different depending on the part of the US you’re in. I can barely understand southern AAVE. NYC AAVE is much faster, but I think NYC p…

They have audio samples if that’s what you mean. The ones from where I grew up were spot on but rare even when I was growing up in the 90s. https://aschmann.net/AmEng/#AudioFilesOfLocalDialects

I looked through and found one rejected video from Montreal. It's crazy to me, to reject someone with a French accent. It's how people talk here! Many consider themselves perfectly bilingual and grew up speaking both languages. Even the more Anglo-Quebecois have a very specific vocabulary and accent heavily influenced by French.

Re: North American English Dialects

#70

Is anyone archiving these accents ? As much as I’m happy that kids now have access to YouTube, and thus can use the neutral influencer dialect, something about our culture is being erased. I grew up speaking both a neutral California accent and bits of AAVE. AAVE itself is drastically different depending on the part of the US you’re in. I can barely understand southern AAVE. NYC AAVE is much faster, but I think NYC p…

Check this out if you haven't seen it before:

https://accent.gmu.edu/browse_language.php?function=find&lan...

Post reply on HN