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Mozilla Thunderbolt

thunderbolt.io

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Re: Mozilla Thunderbolt

#181

Post by jampekka »

captn3m0 wrote: post #156
ryukoposting wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> already painful and readily apparent, stagnation of your browser What's wrong with Firefox? There are several things Firefox does that it's annoying to live without in other browsers (video pop-outs, competent ad blocking, etc). Is there some core feature that's missing? I'm subjected to Edge at work and I couldn't tell you a single thing it does that I'd want FF to do. > and our standards bodies as entities distin…

Firefox on iOS still doesn't support extensions or adblocking - something Safari (and other browsers as well) do.

Firefox on iOS isn't really a Firefox because Apple doesn't allow alternative browsers. It's a Safari skin.

Re: Mozilla Thunderbolt

#182

Post by righthand »

drzaiusx11 wrote: post #81

For anyone reading this that has worked on the launch of this new product (or the many others of their ilk throughout the years) under the various Mozilla orgs, I mean no disrespect, however I feel it's important to not mince words these days.. I implore ANYONE at Mozilla org to please, please stop working on projects distracting from the complex and necessary work of browser and web standards stewardship. That alone…

The Mozilla employees are just Google plants. The web standards are now controlled by WHATWG who are all members of Microsoft, Google, Apple, and Mozilla and they are not interested in pushing standards forward or making browser improvements. They are only interested in ensuring entrenchment for their corporations. That’s why they created WHATWG. There is nothing any non-compromised Mozilla employee can do. The ship has sunk. Either someone hard forks Firefox or we continue down the current road.

Re: Mozilla Thunderbolt

#184

Post by galangalalgol »

realusername wrote: post #173
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It just puts them behind for some stuff. Yeah, it really undermines their ability to compromise user security and privacy.

There's a lot of good use-cases of Web usb, you can't just cut everything which might have privacy aspects otherwise the browsers wouldn't have canvas or even gpu rendering.

What are those use cases? It seems like a giant hole punched all the way from a tab's sandbox through the process boundary and out to the kernel... Yes, gpu rendering is a great example of the same problem. Canvas at least has some intervening layers depending on implementation.

Re: Mozilla Thunderbolt

#185

Post by maxloh »

drzaiusx11 wrote: post #81

For anyone reading this that has worked on the launch of this new product (or the many others of their ilk throughout the years) under the various Mozilla orgs, I mean no disrespect, however I feel it's important to not mince words these days.. I implore ANYONE at Mozilla org to please, please stop working on projects distracting from the complex and necessary work of browser and web standards stewardship. That alone…

Mozilla is doing exactly what you’re describing. They need revenue to ditch their direct financial ties to Google (and I wonder if they hire those high-salary executives solely in the hope of generating that revenue).

These AI products, along with all previous failed attempts, are just them trying to gain enough revenue to remove that dependency on Google.

Re: Mozilla Thunderbolt

#186

Post by jampekka »

latexr wrote: post #155
ryukoposting wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> already painful and readily apparent, stagnation of your browser What's wrong with Firefox? There are several things Firefox does that it's annoying to live without in other browsers (video pop-outs, competent ad blocking, etc). Is there some core feature that's missing? I'm subjected to Edge at work and I couldn't tell you a single thing it does that I'd want FF to do. > and our standards bodies as entities distin…

> What's wrong with Firefox? It seems like every thread talking about Firefox always has someone asking that question, so if you search back you should find plenty of reasons. Unfortunately, it’s been my observation that valid and polite criticisms always get downvoted. I don’t understand why. It’s not like downvotes are going to make the problems disappear. Most of us would like Firefox to succeed, and it’s none of…

I use Firefox on both Linux and Android for 99% of my web browsing needs. At least for me it's the best browser out there, and doesn't seem neglegted at all.

Re: Mozilla Thunderbolt

#187

Post by derf_ »

drzaiusx11 wrote: post #81

For anyone reading this that has worked on the launch of this new product (or the many others of their ilk throughout the years) under the various Mozilla orgs, I mean no disrespect, however I feel it's important to not mince words these days.. I implore ANYONE at Mozilla org to please, please stop working on projects distracting from the complex and necessary work of browser and web standards stewardship. That alone…

These two goals:

> ... please stop working on projects distracting from the complex and necessary work of browser and web standards stewardship.

> Ditching any direct financial ties to Google or any other browser vendor is both important and necessary...

are inherently contradictory. If you do not want Mozilla to have revenue from search vendors that also have browsers, it has to come from somewhere else. Or are you suggesting they switch the default search engine back to Yahoo [0]?

I am not trying to defend the projects they have chosen to work on, but you have to understand that reducing dependence on Google is exactly why they are working on them [1].

[0] Even when they did that, it was for the US only, and Google was still the default for most of the world.

[1] Although in this case, this appears to come from the Thunderbird organization, so unrelated to the browser. Money is fungible, though.

Re: Mozilla Thunderbolt

#188

Post by fmbb »

latexr wrote: post #155
ryukoposting wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> already painful and readily apparent, stagnation of your browser What's wrong with Firefox? There are several things Firefox does that it's annoying to live without in other browsers (video pop-outs, competent ad blocking, etc). Is there some core feature that's missing? I'm subjected to Edge at work and I couldn't tell you a single thing it does that I'd want FF to do. > and our standards bodies as entities distin…

> What's wrong with Firefox? It seems like every thread talking about Firefox always has someone asking that question, so if you search back you should find plenty of reasons. Unfortunately, it’s been my observation that valid and polite criticisms always get downvoted. I don’t understand why. It’s not like downvotes are going to make the problems disappear. Most of us would like Firefox to succeed, and it’s none of…

Upvotes are not going to make problems actually relevant to solve.

The question keeps getting asked because people say they have problems. Answers (if any come) tells everyone what the problem is for this one user that raised it.

In aggregate we can all see that the problems are not very real for the vast majority of users.

The biggest problem users actually face with using Firefox is that web devs don’t want to support more than one browser and they have picked Chrome now. Or IT departments have blessed one and only one browser on corporate machines and it is the one most corpoware developers build extensions for.

Chasing web standards is a second order problem and will not make the user experience better in a relevant manner for end users. If web developers want an open web, they have to work to support open browsers.

Yeah the criticism is not invalid, but it is also often half-relevant soapboxing and I would wager that is why it tends to get downvoted.

Re: Mozilla Thunderbolt

#189

Post by galangalalgol »

latexr wrote: post #129
braiamp wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many milliseconds do you think this page took to render? I usually click and it's already done.

HN is a fast site (comparatively; most websites are unnecessarily slow). It’s a bad measurement.

HN is a good website. Ebay is another good example where JavaScript is optional but with good functionality. Marko was mocked, but now Astro is cool because they invented ssr...

Re: Mozilla Thunderbolt

#190

Post by realusername »

galangalalgol wrote: post #184
realusername wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot of good use-cases of Web usb, you can't just cut everything which might have privacy aspects otherwise the browsers wouldn't have canvas or even gpu rendering.

What are those use cases? It seems like a giant hole punched all the way from a tab's sandbox through the process boundary and out to the kernel... Yes, gpu rendering is a great example of the same problem. Canvas at least has some intervening layers depending on implementation.

GrapheneOS for example can install with web usb, I think it makes it much easier for people who aren't too tech savvy to switch.

Somebody also recently shared an awesome project which let's you use an usb printer regardless of your OS driver.

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