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Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

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Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#61

Post by lxgr »

bobdvb wrote: post #39
Egonex wrote: post #36

People think that with better D2D technology, emergency and telemetry messages will still be short and to the point. These messages will not be like streaming videos. When companies work together on things, like spectrum and constellations and handset deals it changes how people get billed.. It does not change the fact that people want to keep the messages small when millions of devices are using the same channel. I…

Spectrum contention is going to be insane in D2D. Starlink already has to constrain the number of broadband accounts per locale to avoid saturation.

Fixed Starlink is competing with fiber/DOCSIS/DSL, though. That's orders of magnitude more bandwidth than people in areas remote enough to not warrant a terrestrial cell base station (which could itself also be backhauled over much more efficient fixed satellite).

Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#62

Post by AnimalMuppet »

supernova87a wrote: post #38

I remain convinced that the main successful business model in the satellite communications industry is to wait for the first incarnation of the satellite company to fail / go bankrupt / flounder, and then be part of the 2nd round of financing or ownership that comes in to buy it out and operate it... I don't know why this is the pattern but it seems to have played out several times over the last 2 decades that I've c…

You see the same pattern with railroads from 1860 to 1900.

Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#63

Post by lxgr »

cubefox wrote: post #35
jameslk wrote: post #13

SpaceX and Amazon seem to be headed for competing with traditional telecoms and ISPs. I'm betting the next acquisition target will be AST SpaceMobile. I also wouldn’t be surprised to see big telecom/ISP mergers pass regulatory approval now that they have competition from the heavens

> SpaceX and Amazon seem to be headed for competing with traditional telecoms and ISPs. Traditional ISPs already have a nice network of copper and fiber optic cables. I don't think satellites offer any advantage to most people here, except for those living in an area with slow wired connections.

Intercontinental latency in air/vacuum is lower than in fiber (even in total, i.e. after accounting for the extra distance from ground and the legs up and down from/space), so there’s also a market for high frequency trading.

Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#64

Post by iso1631 »

ericmay wrote: post #52
iso1631 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Far easier for someone like Iran or China or the US to take out an LEO satellite than an underground data centre, or even a surface on in the case of DCs in US or China.

I don’t think Iran has the capability to shoot down LEO satellites. Kind of weird to loop them in with China here other than China helping Iran.

You need about 2,500m/s delta V to reach LEO altitude. Iranian long range rockets are well in that range.

It's thus far easier for Iran to hit an LEO DC than one in Colorado

Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#65

Post by iso1631 »

nish__ wrote: post #34
iso1631 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Land is pretty much irellevent in the cost. The Utah Data Center [0] is a 200 acre plot with 35 acres of buildings. Even prime farmland values is arround $10k an acre, or $2m, but for other land you're talking $400k for that much land [1] It uses 65MW. The solar panels alone to generate that cost $100 per kW in bulk, or $6.5m. That's 570GWh a year. Mount Signal 1 Solar plant, from over a decade ago, produces about th…

Not for the data center, for the fiber lines.

Pretty much zero cost. Or just use your satellite capacity you'd use from your space based DC.

Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#66

Post by Zigurd »

jameslk wrote: post #13

SpaceX and Amazon seem to be headed for competing with traditional telecoms and ISPs. I'm betting the next acquisition target will be AST SpaceMobile. I also wouldn’t be surprised to see big telecom/ISP mergers pass regulatory approval now that they have competition from the heavens

They'll try. But they are between two forces squeezing the TAM:

The anvil: satellites can't serve most people in a densely populated area, whereas terrestrial wireless can be engineered and deployed to serve any population density, even tens of thousands of people in a stadium.

The hammer: electronics get cheaper faster when they don't have to be space grade, and electronics get cheaper faster than rockets. As they get cheaper, terrestrial wireless will be deployed in more areas that are uneconomical right now.

And that is how the satellite TAM gets slammed.

Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#67

Post by ericmay »

iso1631 wrote: post #64
ericmay wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think Iran has the capability to shoot down LEO satellites. Kind of weird to loop them in with China here other than China helping Iran.

You need about 2,500m/s delta V to reach LEO altitude. Iranian long range rockets are well in that range. It's thus far easier for Iran to hit an LEO DC than one in Colorado

Are you suggesting for a fact that Iran as the guidance and targeting systems to identify specific LEO objects, and fire missiles at those targets with accuracy?

Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#68

Post by vitorsr »

supernova87a wrote: post #38

I remain convinced that the main successful business model in the satellite communications industry is to wait for the first incarnation of the satellite company to fail / go bankrupt / flounder, and then be part of the 2nd round of financing or ownership that comes in to buy it out and operate it... I don't know why this is the pattern but it seems to have played out several times over the last 2 decades that I've c…

Or become a major investor on a largely public funded project with commitments set to start at a delayed time in order to benefit from R&D before bearing financial burden. (See [1].)

[1] https://www.ft.com/content/8e75ed31-0c72-4160-b406-1ca6aa36a...

Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#69

Post by lxgr »

ericmay wrote: post #52
iso1631 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Far easier for someone like Iran or China or the US to take out an LEO satellite than an underground data centre, or even a surface on in the case of DCs in US or China.

I don’t think Iran has the capability to shoot down LEO satellites. Kind of weird to loop them in with China here other than China helping Iran.

Iran has a space program capable of launching LEO satellites.

Re: Amazon to acquire Globalstar and expand Amazon Leo satellite network

#70

Post by NitpickLawyer »

supernova87a wrote: post #38

I remain convinced that the main successful business model in the satellite communications industry is to wait for the first incarnation of the satellite company to fail / go bankrupt / flounder, and then be part of the 2nd round of financing or ownership that comes in to buy it out and operate it... I don't know why this is the pattern but it seems to have played out several times over the last 2 decades that I've c…

> to fail / go bankrupt / flounder

This is exactly what "the Internet" said about spacex when they announced Starlink. Oh, it never worked. LEO constellations were tried in the 90s, ALL of them failed. Haha, it will never work. 14k satellites, that's insane, dreams, lies, hahaha.

... and yet, they are now at ~10k satellites launched, and are serving 9+mil customers, for some unknown billions/year in revenue (should become clear in a few months when they IPO).

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