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Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

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Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#71

Post by nickpinkston »

schiffern wrote: post #66
ricardobeat wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention they use forging instead of casting for the aluminum bodies, and have their own white paint formula (most manufacturers don't even bother trying to make white devices). Plastic was still the norm for PCs until the "Ultrabook" wave came along.

> Not to mention they use forging instead of casting for the aluminum bodies Apple currently CNC mills all their aluminum bodies.

They cold forge, laser cut, CNC mill, bead blast, and then anodize them actually - there's many processes that go into making such a product.

Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#72

Post by nickpinkston »

bitcartel wrote: post #51
nickpinkston wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have their own aluminum alloy made specifically for the phone. Custom plastics, dyes, colors, etc. They've got enough scale/buyer power to optimize to the n-th. Not to mention that the A-series processor is Apple only, they get early access to the best screens, etc.

Early access to best screens? Maybe not. http://www.theverge.com/2012/10/17/3515158/htc-shows-off-stu...

Yea, well you have to think about what they're optimizing on - I'm sure that you can equal them on some things - but holistically you can't do it for a competitive price. Apple improves where it gives the most bang - and right now they're not really in a "specs war".

They don't play the commodity game - they market on new features, not better - even the better screen was a "First time ever Retina level" where they introduced PPI as a new metric

Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#73

Post by [deleted] »

philwelch wrote: post #31
hahainternet wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forgive me if this is pointless cynicism but fountain of creative ideas ? * A music player * A phone * A portable computer Not exactly the most innovative product categories?

Do you remember what phones were like six years ago?

[deleted]

Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#74

Post by pitchups »

nickpinkston wrote: post #71
schiffern wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Not to mention they use forging instead of casting for the aluminum bodies Apple currently CNC mills all their aluminum bodies.

They cold forge, laser cut, CNC mill, bead blast, and then anodize them actually - there's many processes that go into making such a product.

And what a shame that the majority of users cover it with a cheap, plastic/rubber case! :\

Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#75

Post by 1SaltwaterC »

chimeracoder wrote: post #58
jacques_chester wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Bell Labs had a recipe for brilliant innovation Government-guaranteed monopoly profits? Harder to achieve than it looks.

> Government-guaranteed monopoly profits? They also were forbidden from profiting from a large portion of the work that they did.... If that weren't the case, we wouldn't have GNU.

We wouldn't have OS X as it is today either.

Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#76

Post by chongli »

gwilkes wrote: post #50
alwaysinshade wrote: post #17

I’m glad Tim Cook is trying new things like this, involving Jony Ive in Human Interface design and becoming more involved in charity. I just wish they’d shitcan the lawsuits and get on with making products. Hopefully the HTC licensing agreement is the beginning of the end of SJ’s “thermonuclear” tantrum. The only way to beat the competition is to make products that are too difficult and costly to replicate – they alr…

With the lawsuits, I think too much is made of this. I don't believe it really much affects their ability to make products one way or the other. I don't know if it is still the case but a few years ago they were the most sued company in the world and prior to the iPhone they were getting hit with a ton of patent suits and trolls. So, it seems that starting with the iPhone there was a shift in strategy when Apple real…

>With the lawsuits, I think too much is made of this. I don't believe it really much affects their ability to make products one way or the other.

It may not affect their ability to design their products but it most certainly affects their marketing, image and business relationships. This goes double when it comes to lawsuits against major business partners (like Samsung).

Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#77

Post by skriticos2 »

alwaysinshade wrote: post #17

I’m glad Tim Cook is trying new things like this, involving Jony Ive in Human Interface design and becoming more involved in charity. I just wish they’d shitcan the lawsuits and get on with making products. Hopefully the HTC licensing agreement is the beginning of the end of SJ’s “thermonuclear” tantrum. The only way to beat the competition is to make products that are too difficult and costly to replicate – they alr…

My personal theory is that they just want to keep they're law department sharp. Just in case a real juridical emergency should arise. Having the department sit idle won't do any good. (p.s. this is a joke)

Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#78

Post by michaelochurch »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #67
doomlaser wrote: post #7

I thought that Google didn't really have 20% time anymore.

FWIW, 20% time was always controversial. I was part of 'the surge' (a big hiring wave that peaked in 2006 and then died off) and a common complaint was the low number employees had 100% time (they could work on what ever they wanted) and high number employees had to get their manager's approval, and their manager only approved it if it was something the manager needed doing. Given the nature of that particular 'perk'…

Right. If you're above the Real Googler Line, then not only do you have 20% time, but no one's going to stop you from spending 100% of your time on your 20%T project... it will delay your promotion if your 20%T project isn't successful, but that's all. Real Googlers don't sweat Perf or worry about getting fired. They only pay attention to managerial demands when life events (such as having a kid) increase their expenses and they could really use a promotion this year. Otherwise, they do whatever they want.

If you're below the Real Googler Line, and most new hires are, your 20%T project is your 80%T project: appease your manager. Nothing else matters, not "performance" in the abstract or doing something great for the company. Forget all those distractions. If you're below the RGL, your job is to please your boss and serve his career goals. "Peer review" won't protect you, either, if you're at a lower level, because no one below Staff is taken seriously as a peer reviewer. (Remember, they aren't Real Googlers.)

The whole story around "Google culture" is based on what Google is like for people above the RGL, but it takes several years to get there, and it's next to impossible if you're not at one of the top 3 or 4 campuses.

The Real Googler Line used to be at the Senior rank, but now it seems to be closer to Staff (and some Staff SWEs seem to be below the RGL). That means that if you come in at the SWE 3 level, you're two promotions away from it, in a company where the average promote rate is about 10-15% per year. Unless you have a star manager who gets his reports promoted like butter, you're wasting your time.

Google needed to grow a pair and fight to protect its culture from all these transplant executives who brought in terrible ideas from other companies with shit cultures. It needed to man the fuck up and make open allocation an official, unassailable plank of the culture. Now it's too late.

Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#79

Post by michaelochurch »

genuine wrote: post #60

We talked about doing this at my last job, and never did. When I read "...gives a small group of employees 2 weeks or ‘a limited amount of time’ to work on a project outside of their normal responsibilities at Apple", it made me think of the same attitude- the inability to commit to full-on innovation and creativity. Tim Cook, you are a great CEO, but you don't know how to take sufficient risk to get the reward. Ever…

We talked about doing this at my last job, and never did. When I read "...gives a small group of employees 2 weeks or ‘a limited amount of time’ to work on a project outside of their normal responsibilities at Apple", it made me think of the same attitude- the inability to commit to full-on innovation and creativity. Tim Cook, you are a great CEO, but you don't know how to take sufficient risk to get the reward. Everyone should get the 20% time. Don't do anything half-assed, ever. Even better would be to 1-up Google and say that you don't give a flying fuck what your employees do as long as they are innovating for the company and doing what they love to make people's lives better.

This is an awesome post. I award you with an Indignation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtCiP8B2xpc#t=7s

Re: Apple fires up its version of Google’s "20% time"

#80

Post by michaelochurch »

doomlaser wrote: post #7

I thought that Google didn't really have 20% time anymore.

Google still has 20% time, in the aggregate. About 20% of engineers are Real Googlers and get to work on whatever they want, 100% of the time. The other 80% have one job: appease your manager, because your manager is a SPOF for your whole career. In other words, it's no different from a typical dysfunctional corporation.

Google claims to be a "peer review" driven company, but if you're below the RGL, then the odds are that your peers are too, and then they have no clout and can't protect you from a priapic manager looking to get some bad Perf on.

Senior SWE is the traditional Real Googler Line, but now it's closer to the Staff rank.

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