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AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

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Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#111

Post by JCattheATM »

tokioyoyo wrote: post #97
JCattheATM wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not complicated. Just tax the corporations and billionaires a fair share and setup UBI.

It is very much so complicated though. The conversations about UBI in the internet has been around since I’ve been online. And since then, there hasn’t been a single large scale test of the system to see if it can be compatible with the current version of capitalism that’s ran in the most of the world. Even if I support UBI morally, there isn’t even local appetite for it, yet alone global one. And you’ll run into qui…

> It is very much so complicated though. The conversations about UBI in the internet has been around since I’ve been online.

Polarizing doesn't mean complicated. There's people against it due to ignorance, greed of both, it's certainly not more complicated than that.

> And since then, there hasn’t been a single large scale test of the system to see if it can be compatible with the current version of capitalism that’s ran in the most of the world.

Because people keep fighting against it, because it's scary scary sOcIaLiSm.

> Even if I support UBI morally

As you should, there are no moral arguments against it.

> there isn’t even local appetite for it, yet alone global one.

I would think the majority of the population struggling to pay for groceries would disagree.

> And you’ll run into quick questions about inflations, every chart from UBI-lite era of COVID, and so on.

No reason to think UBI would cause inflation at all, actually.

In any case, this really is the answer. You're worried about disruption due to AI taking jobs, but the only reason there is a problem is because AI will drastically increase inequality by letting rich people and corps become even richer. You want to solve the issue, you solve the disparity by making them give back their fair share. Like I said, simple.

Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#112

Post by tsunamifury »

mindok wrote: post #58
tsunamifury wrote: post #8

We are in an inverse innovators dilemma Automaters dilemma: the labor that is removed from production due to automation can no longer sustain the market’s that that automater was trying to make more efficient. By optimizing just the production half of the economy and not the consumption half you end up breaking the market

I’m convinced that 70% of the workforce of some large organisations is just white collar welfare / adult day care already. Maybe that goes to 80+% as a result of “AI” but doesn’t fundamentally change the model.

I moderately agree here. The theory being that since 95 or so the office computer and internet frankly has already automated most work at the white collar level. We sort of just … like working with humans.

Which I think is much better take than that guy that wrote bullshit jobs.

Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#113

Post by Razengan »

djtango wrote: post #54
nate8bit wrote: post #13

A lot of the magic of LLMs, I think, has been tarnished by these CEOs and other FAANG companies. It might have been a far more interesting world if they didn't bring "AI" or "AGI" into the conversation in such a politicized way.

Magic or no, ultimately "AI" leads to labour displacement and it's just a continuation of the much broader trend of automation driven by computers. Labour displacement leads to an erosion of standards of living and in a world that ties purpose to work is an existential threat on a very practical level. It was always going to be met with violence once it became more than a curiosity for tinkerers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamplighter

Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#114

Post by conartist6 »

I have said repeatedly that when AI eliminates the need for human creativity and work, the only thing left as the natural domain of humans will be bloodshed.

The fact that we're using AI killer robots to wipe each other out in droves doesn't bode well for that future does it...

Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#115

Post by testaccount28 »

JCattheATM wrote: post #92
tokioyoyo wrote: post #72

A bit tangent, but is there anyone working on something for “what if AI pans out?” world? I’m not sure how to explain it, but if in the next 5 years a lot of jobs get displaced because of AI, obviously we’ll have big problems. Is there anyone working on analysis, outcomes, strategies and etc.? I think about it a lot, and would be cool to help and contribute.

It's not complicated. Just tax the corporations and billionaires a fair share and setup UBI.

or just pay the landlords directly and cut out the middlemen!

Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#116

Post by pydry »

quantummagic wrote: post #101
yfw wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If ai benefitted everyone and not just the billionaires we would be viewing it differently.

That's a truism. But it ignores The Iron Law of Oligarchy, Pareto Principle, and dozens more that remind us that power tends towards centralization. It's currently fashionable to call out the billionaires, but if you removed them, they'd just be replaced by corrupt government officials, or something else. That's not to say we should just throw up our hands and accept every social injustice. But IMHO we shouldn't go a…

>we shouldn't go around simplistically implying that all social ills will be solved by neutering the billionaire class.

Not to put too fine a point on it but this was basically how the Japanese post war economic miracle was achieved.

In this case it was America which ordered the Japanese oligarchy to be stripped of its wealth.

We've had decades of propaganda telling us that this is the worst thing we could do for economic growth though so it's natural to doubt.

Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#117

Post by DrProtic »

TiredOfLife wrote: post #108
dwroberts wrote: post #34

> But this is not the way. This is how things devolve into chaos. Meanwhile https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/how-many-people-ha... > U.S.-based rights group HRANA said 3,636 people have been killed since the war erupted. It said 1,701 of those were civilians, including at least 254 children. (Mentioning this specifically because we know the DoD is using AI)

Iran killed 10 times more during protests without using AI. So AI is a clear improvement.

There is 0 evidence that many people died.

Let’s not parrot that media propaganda.

Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#118

Post by MontyCarloHall »

djtango wrote: post #54
nate8bit wrote: post #13

A lot of the magic of LLMs, I think, has been tarnished by these CEOs and other FAANG companies. It might have been a far more interesting world if they didn't bring "AI" or "AGI" into the conversation in such a politicized way.

Magic or no, ultimately "AI" leads to labour displacement and it's just a continuation of the much broader trend of automation driven by computers. Labour displacement leads to an erosion of standards of living and in a world that ties purpose to work is an existential threat on a very practical level. It was always going to be met with violence once it became more than a curiosity for tinkerers.

>Labour displacement leads to an erosion of standards of living

The two biggest labor displacements in human history were the agricultural and industrial revolutions, both of which resulted in enormous gains in human living standards. Can you think of a mass labor displacement that resulted in an overall erosion of living standards? I cannot.

Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#119

Post by fastforwardius »

hackrmn wrote: post #66
nate8bit wrote: post #13

A lot of the magic of LLMs, I think, has been tarnished by these CEOs and other FAANG companies. It might have been a far more interesting world if they didn't bring "AI" or "AGI" into the conversation in such a politicized way.

I don't want to stir up the hornet's nest here, but in my humble opinion the entire problem rests on the unabated and unchecked modern and "late-stage" capitalism model, championed by the U.S. and since exported to and sprung good root everywhere else, even in Europe where it as of yet has a few more checks and balances (which unsurprisingly draws a lot of ire from its acolytes and priests across the Atlantic). Sovie…

Which part of societal model you find inferior? I thought it was mostly economics and bureaucracy.

Re: AI Will Be Met with Violence, and Nothing Good Will Come of It

#120

Post by surgical_fire »

conartist6 wrote: post #114

I have said repeatedly that when AI eliminates the need for human creativity and work, the only thing left as the natural domain of humans will be bloodshed. The fact that we're using AI killer robots to wipe each other out in droves doesn't bode well for that future does it...

If AI eliminates the need for creativity and work, it means that our creativity and work are not meaningful enough to warrant survival.

I don't think we're anywhere near that point.

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