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Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

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Re: Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

#191

Post by didgetmaster »

Spooky23 wrote: post #184
didgetmaster wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you know ANYONE who thinks the same way about Biden's pardons as they do about Trump's? I certainly don't.

People in the conservative ecosystem are very much up in arms about the pardon of Hunter Biden. Like most things in MAGAland, these matters are framed in a certain way, and all nuance is eliminated. The irony of being upset about Biden while being a cheerleader for Don Jr is lost.

I think you totally proved my point. Both conservatives and liberals will almost always look at pardons by a president from their own party much differently than those by a president from the other party.

Re: Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

#192

Post by brandensilva »

mandeepj wrote: post #126
9dev wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing would happen, because SCOTUS decided to grant the president immunity for any crime committed in their official function, which would be the case here. It would literally be possible for the president to order congress killed, offer an automatic pardon to anyone carrying out this order, and establish a monarchy. This single ruling will haunt the United States for the rest of its existence.

>SCOTUS decided to grant the president immunity for any crime committed in their official function That ruling is very broad and vague! I don't think killing Congress is part of POTUS's official job description. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/trump-isnt-immune-from...

That's the thing though. Where do you draw the line from the hitman and the one who ordered it legally in their official capacity.

Re: Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

#194

Post by philipallstar »

rootusrootus wrote: post #173
mattmaroon wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. While I don’t like Trump and never did, several of the prosecutions against him were political. By political, I mean they would not have happened if he had not become a politician, in fact, they didn’t until he became one and an unpopular one at that. And he’s doing much worse now so that’s two.

> they would not have happened if he had not become a politician That is a little vague. Some of his crimes only happened because he became a politician, so of course the prosecution would be seen as political in that sense. What I would like to know is which crimes did he commit that were only prosecuted because he was a politician, which would otherwise have been ignored?

The main crime seems to have been leaving the Democrat party as it raced leftwards.

Re: Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

#195

Post by bdangubic »

didgetmaster wrote: post #181
krapp wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a leftist, and a Democrat by necessity (not by choice) and I would be fine if the power of pardon was removed for Presidents who share my ideology. I would rather have working separation of powers and reform the justice system than give one person carte blanche power to nullify it based on their whim. Not everyone making a political argument is engaging in cynical tribalism. Believe it or not, some people do actu…

Who exactly 'forced' you to become a Democrat? If that were real, I'm pretty sure it would have made the news.

when you have only two choices and you have to be quite insane to choose one of them, you are, for all intents and purposes, forced to choose the other side (same argument works for left and right if you hear someone say they are forced to be what they are politically)

Re: Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

#196

Post by LocalH »

frumplestlatz wrote: post #163
foobarchu wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> puts candidates they know aligned with their views, resulting in 'just wait until my turn comes and I will do as much as damage as possible' cycle. There is exactly one party in the US that does this, and it's because they have dedicated themselves to blocking the other party from accomplishing much of anything when they get power.

Hilariously (to me, anyway) — I genuinely don’t know which party you’re talking about. It could truly be either, depending entirely on which party you support.

Waiting for the day when both the Democrats and Republicans are so very obviously shitty to even the most uninformed voter that we get some new thought in office instead of two sides of the same coin that are both beholden to capital and to foreign interests

Re: Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

#197

Post by krapp »

didgetmaster wrote: post #181
krapp wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a leftist, and a Democrat by necessity (not by choice) and I would be fine if the power of pardon was removed for Presidents who share my ideology. I would rather have working separation of powers and reform the justice system than give one person carte blanche power to nullify it based on their whim. Not everyone making a political argument is engaging in cynical tribalism. Believe it or not, some people do actu…

Who exactly 'forced' you to become a Democrat? If that were real, I'm pretty sure it would have made the news.

I never claimed that anyone forced me to become a Democrat.

I support them at the national level because they're the least evil of the two and exactly two relevant options available, and the one which at least gives lip service to progressive values. But that is still like supporting Mussolini over Hitler. Locally I vote third party when I have a chance.

And I live in Texas so none of my votes matter anyway.

Re: Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

#198

Post by rapnie »

lateforwork wrote: post #92
siliconc0w wrote: post #38

We should at least ban the "preemptive" pardon if not all pardons. Pardon means forgiveness for a specific convicted crime, not a means to grant blanket immunity.

There are two types here: (1) Pardons for crimes not yet committed. (2) Pardons for crimes committed, but not yet convicted. The first type will allow the pardoned to commit a crime in the future for free, which obviously should not be allowed. The second should be allowed if we have this pardon system at all. The second type became a political necessity, for example to protect Liz Cheney from a vengeful administrati…

(3) Morally highly questionable pardons of convicted criminals who committed high crimes. Preferably questioned by a well-functioning ethics commission for things like, well, conflicts of interest, corruption, and the like.

Re: Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

#199

Post by jmyeet »

mullingitover wrote: post #172
jmyeet wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's hard to find quantative data but one clear example is DNA-based exoneration by the Innocence Project [1] > Among the many insights drawn from these wrongful convictions is the realization that a guilty plea is not an uncommon outcome for innocent people who have been charged with a crime: 11 percent of the DNA exonerees recorded by the Innocence Project pleaded guilty There's a thing called the Trial Penalty [2]…

> There's a thing called the Trial Penalty [2]. ~98% of charges result in a guilty plea. The gist of this argument is that there are huge numbers of innocent people railroaded into prison, but in the bigger picture crime is wildly under-punished. More than half of murderers go free. More than 98% of rapists never spend a day in prison. At the end of the day this is all a question of where you stand on Blackstone’s Ra…

> ... but in the bigger picture crime is wildly under-punished.

Um, citation needed.

> More than half of murderers go free.

The burden is on the state to prove their case not on the accused to prove their innocence. If this completely unsubstantiated statistic is true (again, citation needed) why is the state so bad at making their cases?

> More than 98% of rapists never spend a day in prison.

Yes, rape is under-reported, under-charged and rarely results in a conviction. This is true. Society engages in a whole lot of victim blaming with sex crimes.

> we stand solidly opposed to zealous pursuit of justice for the victims of crimes

What? The US has 4% of the world's population but 25% of the world's prisoners. If over-policing and wildly capricious sentences (eg 10+ years for cannabis possession) worked, this would be the safest country on earth.

Why isn't it?

Re: Show HN: Pardonned.com – A searchable database of US Pardons

#200

Post by Onawa »

LocalH wrote: post #196
frumplestlatz wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hilariously (to me, anyway) — I genuinely don’t know which party you’re talking about. It could truly be either, depending entirely on which party you support.

Waiting for the day when both the Democrats and Republicans are so very obviously shitty to even the most uninformed voter that we get some new thought in office instead of two sides of the same coin that are both beholden to capital and to foreign interests

As long as our voting system is "first past the post", it will be nigh impossible for a third party to make any significant headway. IMO Citizens United and first past the post are the two main issues holding the US back from any kind of significant overhaul or change.
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