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FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

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201–210 of 322 posts

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#201
post #106

Just curious, how come at least once a month signal bugs me to turn on notifications? I said no for a reason, every single time - why does it keep asking? Not implying anything evil but it feels a bit weird esp after this.

Pretty sure that's just iOS behavior + app design. If notifications are off, apps will occasionally prompt again to make sure you didn't disable them by accident or miss something

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#202
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. And technically, from a privacy perspective, it's even worse than that. What's additionally happening is they're still 'syncing' back to Apple servers via APNS (and to Alphabet servers via Firebase on Android)—even with notifications completely disabled , that's correct. If the app generates them, the OS receives them. That's why the Signal app offers this setting.

>it's even worse than that. What's additionally happening is they're still 'syncing' back to Apple servers via APNS (and to Alphabet servers via Firebase on Android)—even with notifications completely disabled, that's correct. Source? I don't think either OS implements notification syncing between devices, it's only one way, and as others have mentioned, the actually push notification doesn't contain any message cont…

> I don't think either OS implements notification syncing between devices

iOS does. This is how you can receive Signal notifications on your Apple Watch and other Apple devices that don’t have the app installed.

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#203
post #7

First, a critical setting for Signal users: "Signal’s settings include an option that prevents the actual message content from being previewed in notifications. However, it appears the defendant did not have that setting enabled, which, in turn, seemingly allowed the system to store the content in the database." Second, how can I see this notification history?

So I wonder about this. The quote from the 404 media article [0] is: “We learned that specifically on iPhones, if one’s settings in the Signal app allow for message notifications and previews to show up on the lock screen, [then] the iPhone will internally store those notifications/message previews in the internal memory of the device,” a supporter of the defendants who was taking notes during the trial told 404 Medi…

I think that’s a little nutty. People go to signal for secure messaging. That’s their entire brand. An insecure by default setting is the wrong setting, even if it nets them a lot of tech illiterate users. Compromising the security of the system defeats the entire point of using Signal instead of some other messenger.

By this logic, you, me, and everyone else using the defaults are using bad opsec. Doesn’t that strike you as problematic?

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#204
post #7

First, a critical setting for Signal users: "Signal’s settings include an option that prevents the actual message content from being previewed in notifications. However, it appears the defendant did not have that setting enabled, which, in turn, seemingly allowed the system to store the content in the database." Second, how can I see this notification history?

You don't, at least not without forensics tools

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#205
post #37

> testimony in a recent trial Court cases are the real way to audit security. Larping about security and complaining about companies responding to court orders only gets you so far. Its way more useful to look at what actually happens in reality.

True, court cases are one of the few times details actually surface

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#206

Putting on my user hat... "OK. Signal has forward secrecy. So messages are gone after I receive them. Great!" Oh, you didn't turn on disappearing messages? Oh, right, then forensic tools like Cellebrite can get them. You have to turn on disappearing messages. The default is off. Oh, you did turn on disappearing messages? We send the messages in notifications. So the OS can keep them. Turns out Apple was doing that. T…

The median user isn't going to change default settings, so your app is as secure as whatever the default it.

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#207
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. So I send a push notification with the "silent" flag and encrypted content; the app receives it, decrypts the text, and displays the notification locally. Google/Apple has only ciphertext in their FBI/CIA/NSA-accessible databases.

I'm confused. You mean the iOS system notification would display the decrypted message in plaintext? Or do you mean the iOS system notification would display the encrypted message (i.e. it would be unreadable)?

The app decrypts the message and displays it via the system notification.

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#208
post #102

"However, it appears the defendant did not have that setting enabled, which, in turn, seemingly allowed the system to store the content in the database." "[A]llowing the system to store the content in the database" where a third party, such as Apple or a government, can access it is the default Only a small minority of users know about settings and how to change them. The vast majority of users do not change default…

> Only a small minority of users know about settings and how to change them. I couldn't believe this so went to look up some data on this. Holy FUCK that is bleak. There needs to be way more computer education , not just "how2type" classes.

Unfortunately, users don’t want to learn. They want the app to do what they want. Anything involving learning is likely to get an instant “screw this” reaction. Seen it firsthand many times, and always found it mystifying.

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#209

Terrorism charges. That’s what we should be talking about.

It sounds like they were considering liberating the ICE concentration camp. If you go down that route, you need to be ready for the terrorism charges. They brought rifles and one of them allegedly shot at a cop.

Personally, it's a moral good to free people from a concentration camp, even if it requires violence to do so. However it's also obvious that when you oppose a State, you get hit with terrorism charges. ...unless you're a jan6er, of course.

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#210
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disable notifications on every app that is not on the critical path to me earning a living. Notifications are largely unnecessary. Either you are actively engaged with something, in which case you didn't need the notification, or you are doing something else and don't need the distraction, in which case you didn't need the notification. Only my employer gets a right to demand my time during work hours, which is why…

Signal notifications are the #1 thing in the critical path for me earning a living. Isn’t this normal in our industry?

Nope.
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