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FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

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Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#181

Post by lenerdenator »

preinheimer wrote: post #13
lenerdenator wrote: post #10

There needs to be a bit more "group chat" control in Signal messages, wherein you could enforce certain settings for certain chats regardless of the phone settings. You could have group chats that would enforce not showing more information in the notifications, while others would still allow it.

This feels like it would run against the “I bought my device, I should control how it behaves” line of thinking.

True, though the device could simply not be connected to that chat if the user doesn't want to implement the policies necessary to access that chat.

The major hole here is that you turn off your notifications and don't have a bunch of database records, but the threat actor somehow finds out who your contacts are, gets a hold of their phone, and can then see all of the messages you sent via their notifications database. So if you want to trust the device for secure communications, you can't do that.

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#182

Post by shantara »

throawayonthe wrote: post #84
frizlab wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do not. They send encrypted notifications. It’s the OS that stores them unencrypted. It’s the OS at fault here IMHO.

i think they're replying to the "recommendation" part -- if it was recommended, why isn't it the safe default? i haven't actually seen signal or anyone adjacent recommend that previously though, idk where that claim came from

Sorry, the “recommended” was a bad wording on my part. The recommendation comes from the 404 Media article who did the expose on this incident, not Signal itself.

I’ve checked the Signal documentation page, and there’s no mention of the privacy implications of the setting: https://support.signal.org/hc/en-us/articles/360043273491-In...

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#183

Post by pastel8739 »

pigggg wrote: post #164
cbg0 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do most people keep the notifications disabled for their messaging apps?

It's just a mental compartmentalization thing for me. When I want to get into slack/signal chatting mode or read messages I load such an app and look/interact. When I'm not doing that I don't want to be bothered with messages. I'm already sacrificing a portion of my life to work related tasks and being in front of a computer at many hours, when I'm not in that mode I don't want to be interrupted - people who need to…

But maybe _you_ are the minority

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#184

Post by Forgeties79 »

ethanrutherford wrote: post #141
ryandrake wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why does it keep asking? Why does any software keep asking you to do things you explicitly told them you don't want to do? Because it's in the software developer's best interest to get you to do them, not yours. We've gotten way past the point in software where we no longer expect the software to serve the user's interest and solve the user's problems. Now, the expectation is that the user gets nagged and coerced i…

It's pretty shortsighted, bordering on intentionally obtuse, to insinuate that the only person that benefits from solving the support problem is the person on support.. Take the example of automatic backups others brought up in this thread. Are you really going to imply that there's zero benefit to the person who didn't lose their data because the app reminded them to turn backups on ? I don't disagree that it could…

If a person says “no” to a prompt multiple times then either they aren’t reading it and never will or they definitely know they are not interested and at some point it needs to stop.

At some point it is just not beneficial anymore.

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#185

Post by sneak »

tristor wrote: post #153
cbg0 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do most people keep the notifications disabled for their messaging apps?

I disable notifications on every app that is not on the critical path to me earning a living. Notifications are largely unnecessary. Either you are actively engaged with something, in which case you didn't need the notification, or you are doing something else and don't need the distraction, in which case you didn't need the notification. Only my employer gets a right to demand my time during work hours, which is why…

Signal notifications are the #1 thing in the critical path for me earning a living. Isn’t this normal in our industry?

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#186

Post by SilasX »

Hmmm this is interesting. Because I've long had the complaint that notifications are frustratingly ephemeral. There have been many cases where I've gotten a notification that my phone clearly has but which I can't read, because when I tap it, it's purged permanently, and then I have a spotty internet connection, so I can't see it in the actual app that loaded.

I'm always like "JFC, can't you cache the notifications, so I can see it there while waiting for the app to gets its act together?" But no, that's never an option.

So I'm getting a laugh out of how notifications last long enough to be extracted by someone just not the person that they're for. (Though to be fair, it could be a case of a notification that was never tapped, and therefore hadn't been purged yet. I couldn't tell from the story.)

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#189

Post by jhatemyjob »

SergeAx wrote: post #92
tbrownaw wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "e" in e2e encryption is a computing device, not the device's user's brain.

Right. So I send a push notification with the "silent" flag and encrypted content; the app receives it, decrypts the text, and displays the notification locally. Google/Apple has only ciphertext in their FBI/CIA/NSA-accessible databases.

I'm confused. You mean the iOS system notification would display the decrypted message in plaintext? Or do you mean the iOS system notification would display the encrypted message (i.e. it would be unreadable)?

Re: FBI used iPhone notification data to retrieve deleted Signal messages

#190

Post by scarecrowbob »

seethishat wrote: post #160

A lot of dumb criminals seem to carry smart phones. The irony.

Probably, but these are people who are being charged for political "crimes" brought mostly because the government doesn't think people have a right to protest. While it's unsurprising that the citizen who discharged their weapon was tried for this, most of the other folks were just doing run-of-the-mill protest stuff.

I also get that in Texas they are fine "criminalizing" protesting, but that's just part of its hyper-authoritarian "charm", and a lot of us don't think that protesting in itself should be criminal.

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