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The Pentagon Threatened Pope Leo XIV's Ambassador with the Avignon Papacy

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Re: The Pentagon Threatened Pope Leo XIV's Ambassador with the Avignon Papacy

#31

Post by uxp100 »

mapotofu wrote: post #16
Avicebron wrote: post #3

Idk which is more impressive that someone referenced the Avignon Papacy in a heat of the moment argument or that the same person who could reference that thought it was a good idea. (Not Catholic...but like...why?)

> the same person who could reference that Let’s not give that same person more credit than they deserve. I’m sure they came preprepared with some LLM derived threats for when they didn’t get what they wanted from the Vatican.

Nah, I’m sure Elbridge Colby knew about this. His political views may be unpleasant (I mean, I think there is far worse in the Trump administration, but I’m not a supporter of any of them) but he’s definitely in the well read in history section of maga.

Re: The Pentagon Threatened Pope Leo XIV's Ambassador with the Avignon Papacy

#32

Post by embedding-shape »

water_badger wrote: post #8
frm88 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt many are Catholic. J.D. Vance would be an option, tho.

well, ~21% of americans are catholic

"are Catholic" is so fuzzy though. "identify as" and "practices" are wildly different experiences, at least on the receiving end. I'm sure that percentage is mostly consisting of "identify as" rather than "practicing".

Re: The Pentagon Threatened Pope Leo XIV's Ambassador with the Avignon Papacy

#33

Post by mullingitover »

Time in minutes after which christian nationalists will form a circular firing squad once they've cemented their grip on the US government: 2

The past which the 'make america great again' people want to take us back to absolutely loathed Catholics, something I don't think modern Catholics realize.

The colony of Maryland was originally intended to be a safe place for Catholics, and the first chance the Puritans got, they revolted, invaded, burned the Catholic churches down and persecuted their worshippers. The US was explicitly not founded on religious tolerance, it was founded on freedom to persecute Catholics.

Re: The Pentagon Threatened Pope Leo XIV's Ambassador with the Avignon Papacy

#36

Post by stevenwoo »

School-Cotton wrote: post #14
the_af wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't know about the leadership, but a quick googling tells me about 25% of the US military identify as Catholic. That's not nothing...

My guess is the vast majority of those are Hispanic Americans who have been Catholic since birth, and not part of the modern far-right Catholic conversion movement (like Vance).

Trump got 48 percent of Hispanic American vote in 2024, a historic high for the GOP. The anti women and anti immigrant parts (in spite of what appears to be cognitive dissonance) of the GOP platform are very popular in that community from what I have seen.

Re: The Pentagon Threatened Pope Leo XIV's Ambassador with the Avignon Papacy

#37

Post by embedding-shape »

FrustratedMonky wrote: post #24

Lot of Catholics are MAGA aren't they? The few I talked to recently were really anti-woke, like 'woke' is ruining the world. Very Maga. How does this land with them?

I guess it's obvious from the outside, maybe not so much from the inside, but it's clear they're massaging the MAGA masses to establish the new pope as someone who isn't a real pope, so probably won't matter much, since this approach is already underway.

Re: The Pentagon Threatened Pope Leo XIV's Ambassador with the Avignon Papacy

#38

Post by CGMthrowaway »

sqircles wrote: post #20

I have recently deepened my search in Christianity which started with the Catholic Church, one of few points I struggle with when it comes to Catholicism is the papacy, and the Avignon Papacy debacle and the events that followed (a la Western Schism) has quite a bit to do with that. I was a little confused by what they meant here by “threatening with the Avignon Papacy.” If anyone else is curious, I think the phrase…

There's way too much misdirected emphasis on the pope and ecclesiastical hierarchy imo. I wouldn't think too hard about it. You can be catholic and not like the pope just the same as you can be french and not like the king. Or american and not like the president. There is only one divinity on earth today and that's the holy spirit (consubstantial with the father and son), indwelling and guiding humanity on many levels
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