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Non-hiring Practices

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Re: Non-hiring Practices

#11

Post by linuxhansl »

I agree. I have been on the side of not receiving any update after an interview, and also on the side of having to poke the recruiters about whether they got back to the interviewee when we decided to pass on him/her; and finally doing it myself.

It is absolutely the decent thing to do. I feel sorry for people who only have interest in you as long as they can potentially get something from you. Typically I avoid associating with such people, as that says a lot about their ethical standards.

Edit: Spelling

Re: Non-hiring Practices

#12

Post by suresk »

rizzom5000 wrote: post #5
luu wrote: post #2

Many years ago, I applied for a Google job that I was totally unqualified for. I didn't even get an interview, but they sent me a nice snail mail paper rejection letter anyway. I've heard mixed things about their interview process, but I still get a have a nebulous warm fuzzy feeling when I think about possibly sending a resume in again one day, because of one simple, probably automated, $.29[1] response. Conversely,…

While you might disagree, asking to start in two-months is not exactly the same as salary negotiation. Most places have schedules and deadlines and the reason they are hiring is often due to the fact that they have a project that needs to meet some deadline on schedule. Two months in the project lifecycle is a long time for any project. I'm not surprised they gave you the silent treatment. On the other hand, had you…

Asking to delay the start date by two months might not be standard, but it isn't incredibly unreasonable either - if they are already employed, they are going to be delaying by 2-3 weeks by default anyway, and finding another candidate may end up taking just as long anyway.

It's probably something that should be brought up before an offer is made, but I don't think it is a good reason for a company to simply ignore someone they've made an offer to - a polite "no, we need you to start within 2-3 weeks" is an acceptable response.

Re: Non-hiring Practices

#13

Post by linuxhansl »

munin wrote: post #10

I have been instructed by legal affairs that non-contact after rejection is the safest choice for avoiding discrimination lawsuits. whether or not this is true, too much direct disobedience of management and legal usually results in starting ones own job search...

Wow. This makes me sad. Sounds like unreasonable fear of a lawsuit stands in the way of common courtesy and decency here.

Re: Non-hiring Practices

#14

Post by suresk »

munin wrote: post #10

I have been instructed by legal affairs that non-contact after rejection is the safest choice for avoiding discrimination lawsuits. whether or not this is true, too much direct disobedience of management and legal usually results in starting ones own job search...

I wonder why this is seen as being an effective way of mitigating the risk of discrimination lawsuits? At some point, whether you explicitly tell them or not, the candidate knows they didn't get the job.

I can see where it might be problematic to go into reasons why they didn't get the job, but I'm having a hard time seeing what risks a simple notice informing them they didn't get it causes?

Re: Non-hiring Practices

#15

Post by linuxhansl »

rizzom5000 wrote: post #4

While I agree that it is the decent thing to do, the whole '' Reply>Copy>Paste>Send. 5 seconds.' is probably not entirely accurate. Many organizations spend weeks going through hundreds of applications before contacting the candidates that they are interested in. Also, in general, if you've applied and haven't heard anything back by the end of the week, it's probably safe to cross them off your list. If it turns out…

When organization "spend weeks going through hundreds of applications", presumably they'd have enough staff to notify those they are interested in.

Most interviewees will send a ping after a few days anyway, and eventually somebody will have to respond anyway, but it is a one-off action, rather than something that can be woven into the interview process.

Also, telling interviewee why they failed helps them to improve. How can they improve without that feedback?

Re: Non-hiring Practices

#16

Post by pbiggar »

rizzom5000 wrote: post #4

While I agree that it is the decent thing to do, the whole '' Reply>Copy>Paste>Send. 5 seconds.' is probably not entirely accurate. Many organizations spend weeks going through hundreds of applications before contacting the candidates that they are interested in. Also, in general, if you've applied and haven't heard anything back by the end of the week, it's probably safe to cross them off your list. If it turns out…

There's a difference between the cold emails you've gotten, and people that you've actually spoken to about a position. There should be no doubt that if you've had any sort of back-and-forth at all, the applicant deserved at least a short no-thank-you.

Re: Non-hiring Practices

#17

Post by phamilton »

rizzom5000 wrote: post #5
luu wrote: post #2

Many years ago, I applied for a Google job that I was totally unqualified for. I didn't even get an interview, but they sent me a nice snail mail paper rejection letter anyway. I've heard mixed things about their interview process, but I still get a have a nebulous warm fuzzy feeling when I think about possibly sending a resume in again one day, because of one simple, probably automated, $.29[1] response. Conversely,…

While you might disagree, asking to start in two-months is not exactly the same as salary negotiation. Most places have schedules and deadlines and the reason they are hiring is often due to the fact that they have a project that needs to meet some deadline on schedule. Two months in the project lifecycle is a long time for any project. I'm not surprised they gave you the silent treatment. On the other hand, had you…

"Two months in the project lifecycle is a long time for any project. I'm not surprised they gave you the silent treatment. On the other hand, had you asked for more money, I'd be surprised if they balked -- if their offer was genuine."

Not in the hardware world. 2 months is nothing.

Re: Non-hiring Practices

#18

Post by alalonde »

Naturally, this goes way beyond non-hiring. Invited to do something but can't/don't want to? Don't ignore the invitee; let her know. Send that text. You can tell a lot about your relationship with someone by this.

Re: Non-hiring Practices

#19

Post by prostoalex »

This is an unfortunate side effect of recruiter compensation. Most internal recruiters are paid a somewhat low (for Valley at least) base with a nice bonus when a certain quantity of hires is reached.

Thus internal recruiting is a sweatshop assembly line where it's always juggling between closing the candidates who passed the interview round and moving on to sourcing the next batch.

Almost no company puts effort (or pays bonuses) for nice rejections. Depending on the status of the recruiter himself (full-time vs contractor brought in to boost the company to a certain headcount), your rejection might generate a reply. Internal recruiters won't bother (they simply don't have time for it and are not compensated in any way), but contractor guns-for-hire will reach out and be nice about it, since in 6 months they'll move on to another company, and you'll still be in their rolodex as a potential candidate they can hit again to reach their quota.

Re: Non-hiring Practices

#20

Post by docdoc »

Such an important issue. A few years ago, I applied to McKinsey & Co as a resident. I had a pleasant time interviewing and got to the final round. I asked many questions as I was a physician and had no prior background in business but I was really interested and thought this was my calling in life. Their average response time via email was 57 minutes during recruitment. I just checked my old emails.

After my final round, I waited patiently ... and then waited some more. I emailed my recruiter, my "buddy" and my interviewers. I really was interested in working there but I had to make a decision on other jobs. I told them that and they said someone will contact me. 6 weeks later, after I had already taken another job, a recruiter called me saying that I didn't get the job because I did not make their "bar" and a partner will call me with feedback. 3 years later and still no call.

I guess I should be happy that they did eventually contact me but it left a very bitter taste.

Fast forward to two months ago. I was in the position of finding a consulting company to help our hospital system with financial issues. 3 large hospitals. Multimillion dollar contract. McKinsey & Co.'s name came up a few times but my bad experience is what made me eventually recommend another company. One that I got rejected from after the first round but made me feel good. They gave me feedback and didn't make me feel like crap.

Most people claim that McKinsey has a great feedback system, but it failed in my experience and maybe that is what led to us choosing another consulting company.

It taught me a great lesson though. Regardless of who I interview now; resident, attending, or any other position, I personally call them to let them know our decision.

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