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Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

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Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#61

Post by bko »

Capricorn2481 wrote: post #45
bko wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He honeymooned in USSR. Which is a rather odd place to honeymoon in 1988. But yes, he never explicitly said he was a communist, but just someone that wants to seize the means of production.

He literally said “I don’t believe government should take over the grocery store down the street or own the means of production.” https://pjmedia.com/ron-radosh/2016/01/18/no-new-york-post-b...

The grocery store thing is a red herring, although its supported by nyc who by your logic is a communist? Thats hardly a definitive test. There are more relevant industries

In a 1976 interview, Sanders said, “I favor the public ownership of utilities, banks and major industries,” and when told that sounded like socialism, he replied, “Of course.”

“public ownership of the major means of production and their conversion into worker-controlled enterprises.”

More recently, Sanders has also been described as backing worker ownership plans, with reporting that he was encouraging workers to take control of the means of production.

https://reason.com/2019/03/14/bernie-sanders-wanted-public-o...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/14/politics/kfile-bernie-nationa...

https://www.peoplesworld.org/article/bernie-sanders-workers-...

Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#62

Post by anon7000 »

Reubend wrote: post #52

AI is the best thing that happened to America in the last decade, and I dearly hope that politicians don't try to ruin it the way they're ruining other parts of the country. I respect some of Bernie's positions, but his stance on tech is dangerous.

To America as a whole? How?

AI is certainly powerful, but despite tech CEO whitewashing, none of them are planning for how the economy will recover from a potential devastation of white collar jobs. Token bills fund rich investors & executives, not everyday Americans.

For AI to give me abundant free time & happiness, I need to have money, and I don’t see UBI anywhere on OpenAI’s roadmap.

Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#63

Post by anon7000 »

stonyrubbish wrote: post #29

AI is probably in need of far more legal safeguards than we have now, but I am sort of tired of the "everyone will lose their jobs" narrative. There are so few jobs LLMs can fully automate. I think what will actually happen is that corporate CEOs will try to cut staff, it won't work, people will be rehired, and AI will largely make people's jobs easier and less labor-intensive.

No, my job is already highly LLM assisted and I just have more work to do. Because now I can tackle things on the backlog we thought could never be prioritized.

Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#64

Post by anon7000 »

0xy wrote: post #35
SilverElfin wrote: post #30

It’s a threat to employment, stability, and democracy. AI is going to solidify the concentration of wealth and power like never before. It’s why so many young people fear being in the “permanent underclass”. I haven’t agreed with socialists historically but we need to change our economic and political system to have more socialism than before, and especially to reduce the concentration in the hands of a few individua…

Explain why this stance, repeated often throughout history at the first sight of innovation (the plow, the car, electricity, phones, the internet, etc), and wrong every single time, is correct now.

It wasn’t wrong every single time. In fact, many of the more successful social programs in the US happened as a response to extreme poverty and economic disruption (the Great Depression).

People need to get it into their fucking heads that things get really ugly and violent under systems of extreme income inequality.

So far, AI is not focusing on solving that problem, just making it easier for tech people to get richer.

Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#65

Post by mapotofu »

Reubend wrote: post #52

AI is the best thing that happened to America in the last decade, and I dearly hope that politicians don't try to ruin it the way they're ruining other parts of the country. I respect some of Bernie's positions, but his stance on tech is dangerous.

For those of us who watched FB play the “move fast and break things” card, and are now watching the predicted effects of that play out, we think people like YOU are dangerous, and we respect people like Bernie for trying to pump the brakes (knowing the last 10 years have been downhill).

Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#66

Post by namr2000 »

ragequittah wrote: post #55
stonyrubbish wrote: post #29

AI is probably in need of far more legal safeguards than we have now, but I am sort of tired of the "everyone will lose their jobs" narrative. There are so few jobs LLMs can fully automate. I think what will actually happen is that corporate CEOs will try to cut staff, it won't work, people will be rehired, and AI will largely make people's jobs easier and less labor-intensive.

The way this always works in a corporation is people's jobs will be just as hard or harder and they'll hire far less people. As always happens productivity per person will skyrocket and median wages will somehow be lower.

Real median wages have been increasing pretty consistently since the FRED started recording it: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEPAINUSA672N

Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#67

Post by therealpygon »

stonyrubbish wrote: post #29

AI is probably in need of far more legal safeguards than we have now, but I am sort of tired of the "everyone will lose their jobs" narrative. There are so few jobs LLMs can fully automate. I think what will actually happen is that corporate CEOs will try to cut staff, it won't work, people will be rehired, and AI will largely make people's jobs easier and less labor-intensive.

I’m equally disheartened by the people who dismiss job losses as unlikely because “AI can’t automate entire jobs”.

What do you suggest happens when you automate half of 10 people’s jobs? Do you expect they want to pay for 10 people to operate at 50%, or would someone be more likely to just keep 5 people to do the part they couldn’t automate (yet)? Do you think CEOs will want to add 5 more heads back later, or do you think they will add the minimum necessary and still seek a cheap alternative to fill remaining gaps?

I absolutely agree with you that it COULD make people’s jobs easier, but unless that directly translates into revenue for the company, a relaxing easy day of work isn’t generally the goal of profitable companies.

Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#68

Post by guzfip »

Capricorn2481 wrote: post #41
KetoManx64 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure has done a lot to support communism for someone that has never called himself a communist: https://nypost.com/2016/01/16/dont-be-fooled-by-bernie-sande...

My god dude. This is an opinion piece from the New York Post, which is a truly bottom of the barrel rag. Why are you posting this? You can plainly see how hard they are stretching the truth here. An actual anti-communist Republican already explained how stupid this article is [1]. They call the United Packinghouse Workers Union a communist organization, which is a flat out lie. The UPWA was a mainstream CIO (later AF…

> Why are you posting this?

What do you mean? NYPost became front page HN material some years ago.

Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#69

Post by guzfip »

slater wrote: post #37
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The plow was regarded as a threat to democracy? I'm going to need to see some references for that claim...

(not OP but likely they're trying some "Luddites were wrong, too!" thing. And if so, also misunderstanding the Luddites)

Jesus, these people are so stupid, they can’t even ask an LLM to come up with a more comprehensible response.

Re: Bernie Sanders: "AI Is a Threat to Everything the American People Hold Dear"

#70

Post by treetalker »

robotburrito wrote: post #34
treetalker wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pray tell, for which special-interest groups is the venerable senator a mouthpiece?

People who want healthcare and maybe kids who would like school lunch I guess?

This was my sense as well. I was unaware of Sanders's being in the pocket of any AI companies or folks, and I don't see any evidence to the contrary from the other commenters.
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