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Peptides: where to begin?

science.org

141–150 of 431 posts

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#141
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes? These types of injuries are common among bodybuilders and powerlifters.

Pfft -- they're common among anyone over 30 who exercises!

> they're common among anyone over 30 who exercises

They shouldn't be. If someone has chronic tendon or joint issues, that's something to discuss with a doctor and a trainer.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#142
post #133
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's because you grew up in a society still deeply coded to puritan moral viewpoints. People for so upset that GLP-1 has no long term side effects. There's still the crowd completely sure everyone will get HyperCancer in 10 years or something (they won't).

I'm glad we have GLP-1, and I don't think there are really major side effects. But they are ineffective outside clinical trial setting for treating obesity. It seems to be like treating alcoholism with disulfiram: it's a miracle in clinical trials but in the real world the patients just lower the doses or discontinue treatment after 1-2 years and go back to their old habits.

> they are ineffective outside clinical trial setting for treating obesity

This is totally false. I know a number of people who took GLP-1 to treat their obesity and then stopped and have stayed not obese.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#143
I'm not inclined to be a guinea pig for these. I suspect maybe later in my child's life they will have been proven long-term safe (or not). I'll be old or dead at that point. I'm really wary of putting anything not known to be standard food or medicine into my body.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most people don't believe it anyway Maybe because so much of it is wrong, or (very charitably, as much is industry-biased) outdated? Lifestyle modification is a definite challenge and I’m not dismissing it. Still, hamburgers and milkshakes don’t give you heart disease and cancer. Overeating, oxidative stress from low-quality ingredients, etc might.

> hamburgers and milkshakes don’t give you heart disease and cancer They absolutely do, particularly if you're getting most of your calories from them. If evidence-based medicine doesn't convince you, uh, hamburgers and supermarket milk tends to be processed.

They absolutely do not, unless you’re getting too many calories.

Individual foods are—with some exceptions—neither bad for you nor good for you. A healthy diet can occasionally include doughnuts, and milkshakes. Your overall diet is what matters.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> hamburgers and milkshakes don’t give you heart disease and cancer They absolutely do, particularly if you're getting most of your calories from them. If evidence-based medicine doesn't convince you, uh, hamburgers and supermarket milk tends to be processed.

They absolutely do not, unless you’re getting too many calories. Individual foods are—with some exceptions—neither bad for you nor good for you. A healthy diet can occasionally include doughnuts, and milkshakes. Your overall diet is what matters.

Sure. We’re saying roughly the same thing. For most Americans, hamburgers cause heart disease because we don’t exercise enough or eat enough plants. If you’re backpacking twenty miles a day, sure, eat whatever, you won’t suffer inflammation or obesity from it. (Though you may run nutritional deficiencies. And you’re building bad habits for when your activity necessarily tapers off.)

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#146
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm glad we have GLP-1, and I don't think there are really major side effects. But they are ineffective outside clinical trial setting for treating obesity. It seems to be like treating alcoholism with disulfiram: it's a miracle in clinical trials but in the real world the patients just lower the doses or discontinue treatment after 1-2 years and go back to their old habits.

> they are ineffective outside clinical trial setting for treating obesity This is totally false. I know a number of people who took GLP-1 to treat their obesity and then stopped and have stayed not obese.

If only there were a federal administration whose responsibility it was to collect data about food and drugs so we could rely on something more than anecdotes from random strangers on the Internet.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to buy from Peptide Sciences so I was certainly paying a premium for reputation at $20/mg. I think Semaglutide is now at a bit of a premium due to it falling out of favour and most people switching to Triz and Reta. I only take a low dose and am happy to stick with what's working. There must be an irony that it was Trumps crackdown on peptides, I presume to prop up his prescription company, that forced me to s…

IIRC the biggest impetus for cracking down was Lilly throwing a fit about the gray market supplying reta well before it even becomes available via the normal channels (who knows when that will be). But as you say, it just pushes people to buy direct from Chinese vendors (and it is basically impossible to stop direct imports like that). Would be safer if more reputable US-based sellers could supply it semi-openly as b…

> and it is basically impossible to stop direct imports like that

How so? Is there a particular characteristic of the US that makes it so, or of the channels through which this is done? I get that in general it's impossible as with recreational drugs, but when you look at cocaine then at least to traffick it to most wealthy countries it takes a large amount of resources and is at high risk of getting caught. Which is why they're increasingly starting to use narco submarines. This greatly increases the price of the product. Why can't the same happen to peptide imports?

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#148

> a patient who is discontinuing her statin therapy - very inadvisably, given the clinical presentation described - but is enthusiastic about “BPC-157” This feels new. I thought the methylene-blue-for-cancer types continued their medicine while taking other things as extras. Personally, I've swung over to the laissez-faire side of medicine. At the end of the day, if you're an adult, it's your body. You should be give…

> Personally, I've swung over to the laissez-faire side of medicine.

Chesterton’s Fence rears its ugly head again. This is the same thing as vaccine skepticism (those diseases can’t be that bad, I never hear about them killing anyone these days) applied to a different context

Arguing for modern reforms is one thing, but there’s a reason we have the FDA. Statistically, most individuals do not have the medical expertise or the desire or ability to wade through enough clinical data to make these sorts of decisions with any hope of good outcomes, particularly in the face of an entire Internet of people trying to push questionable substances on them.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#149

Peptides are a revolution and you don't need to know how they work to know that they work (for various people for various conditions). There is a tension between empiricism and fundamentalism with much of medical science focusing on fundamentalism. Now with the ability to collect and search large amounts of empirical data and communicate it peer-to-peer people are picking up on a lot of things that work without knowi…

> you don't need to know how they work to know that they work

Welcome to the powerful world of the placebo

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they are ineffective outside clinical trial setting for treating obesity This is totally false. I know a number of people who took GLP-1 to treat their obesity and then stopped and have stayed not obese.

If only there were a federal administration whose responsibility it was to collect data about food and drugs so we could rely on something more than anecdotes from random strangers on the Internet.

Do you have a link to those data showing GLP-1 agonists are ineffective?
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