Any ideas for locking down remote access from an untrusted VM? Cloudflare has object-based capabilities and some similar thing might be useful to let a VM make remote requests without giving it API keys. (Keys could be exfiltrated via prompt injection.)
Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
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Re: Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
#62Any ideas for locking down remote access from an untrusted VM? Cloudflare has object-based capabilities and some similar thing might be useful to let a VM make remote requests without giving it API keys. (Keys could be exfiltrated via prompt injection.)
So we have there are 3 solutions to this, Freestyle supports 2 of them:
1. Freestyle supports multiple linux users. All linux users on the VM are locked down, so its safe to have a part of the vm that has your secret keys/code that the other parts cannot access.
2. A custom proxy that routes the traffic with the keys outside
3. We're working on a secrets api to intercept traffic and inject keys based on specific domains and specific protocols starting with HTTP Headers, HTTP Git Authentication and Postgres. That'll land in a few weeks.
Re: Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
#63It's hard to tell what this is or how it compares to other things that are out there, but what I latched onto is this: > Freestyle is the only sandbox provider with built-in multi-tenant git hosting — create thousands of repos via API and pair them directly with sandboxes for seamless code management. On top of that, Freestyle VMs are full Linux virtual machines with nested virtualization, systemd, and a complete net…
So the snapshotting tech is actually 100% independent of Git.
Git is useful for branching vs forking (IE you can't merge two VM forks back together), but all the tech I showed in the Loom exists independently from Git.
The hard part of it was making the VM large and powerful while making snapshotting/forking instant, which required a lot of custom VMM work.
Re: Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
#64Wow, forking memory along with disk space this quickly is fascinating! That's something that I haven't seen from your competitors.
If the machine can fork itself, it could allow for some really neat auto-forking workflows where you fuzz the UI testing of a website by forking at every decision point. I forget the name of the recent model that used only video as its latent space to control computers and cars, but they had an impressive demo where they fuzzed a bank interface by doing this, and it ended up with an impressive number of permutations of reachable UI states.
Re: Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
#65Earlier quoted context omitted.
unless i am misundestanding. not sure how this computer prevents secrets from my gmail leaking. thats the worst case.
If you put your gmail credentials into a VM that an AI Agent dealing with untrusted prompts has access to they should be treated as leaked and be disabled immediately. However, if you don't put your administrative credentials inside of the VM and treat it as an unsafe environment you can safely give it minimal permissions to access specific things that it needs and using that access it can perform complex tasks.
i am talking about this . not my gmail credentials.
https://simonwillison.net/2024/Mar/5/prompt-injection-jailbr...
Re: Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
#66I think one of the very few who actually support ebpf & xdp, which you do need when you're building low level stuff. + the bare metal setup is like out of the world lol.
Re: Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
#67Non open source and non local SAAS sandboxes are offensive to even try to launch. No one needs this and the only customers will be vibe coders who just don't know any better. There are teams building actual sandboxes like smolmachines, podman, colima and mre. At least be honest and put the virtualisation tech you are using as well as that its closed source SAAS on the landing page to safe people time.
Re: Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
#68Wow, forking memory along with disk space this quickly is fascinating! That's something that I haven't seen from your competitors. If the machine can fork itself, it could allow for some really neat auto-forking workflows where you fuzz the UI testing of a website by forking at every decision point. I forget the name of the recent model that used only video as its latent space to control computers and cars, but they…
That’s what I’m hoping for!
Re: Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
#69I think one of the very few who actually support ebpf & xdp, which you do need when you're building low level stuff. + the bare metal setup is like out of the world lol.
Tx it took a lot of work lol
Re: Launch HN: Freestyle – Sandboxes for Coding Agents
#70Non open source and non local SAAS sandboxes are offensive to even try to launch. No one needs this and the only customers will be vibe coders who just don't know any better. There are teams building actual sandboxes like smolmachines, podman, colima and mre. At least be honest and put the virtualisation tech you are using as well as that its closed source SAAS on the landing page to safe people time.
Our users are platforms, and many of the best already build on us.
Self hosting is a valuable feature but our technology is unfriendly to small nodes — it will not work on consumer hardware. Many of the optimizations we spend our time on only seriously kick in above 2TB of storage and above 500GB of RAM.