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The Claude Code Leak

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Re: The Claude Code Leak

#171

Post by lukewarm707 »

miki123211 wrote: post #120
Frieren wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are several ways of looking at law and order. One way is that the law applies to everybody equally. That has been the way it works for many years, not perfectly, in democratic countries. There is another way of working were the law is not blind. Laws are applied based in who is the one affected. This is what big tech and the ultra-rich have been advocating for. The law applies differently to nobility and aristo…

A third way of looking at it is that you can't just blindly copy arguments when the situations are clearly different. Nobody, not even Anthropic, is arguing that they should be able to host other people's paid content for free. The crux of their fair-use defense is that models are transformative works, just like parodies or book reviews, and hence should be treated as fair use. You can't just take a pile of books (no…

anthropic argue that you should not use claude API to train your model

Situation A - Anthropic pays for a book - Anthropic transform the book into a new llm (transformative use) -> OK

Situation B - I pay for Anthropic API - I transform API responses into a new model (transformative use) -> Not OK

the situations, are clearly the same

Re: The Claude Code Leak

#172

Post by tipiirai »

grey-area wrote: post #106
tipiirai wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly makes you say that "the author who seems to have fully signed up for the LLM hype train"? I feel the author is just stating the obvious: code quality has very little to do with whether a product succeeds

OK, but what happens after product market fit when your code is hot garbage that nobody understands?

This is a different question, but obviously, a code that "nobody understands" is a terrible situation

Re: The Claude Code Leak

#173

Post by lukewarm707 »

abigail95 wrote: post #134
jiusanzhou wrote: post #77

The copyright angle is the most underrated part of this story. Anthropic built their models on other people's code under the fair use argument, but the moment their own code leaks they reach for DMCA takedowns. You can't have it both ways. The clean room reimplementations are the natural consequence of the legal framework they themselves advocated for.

What is your fair use claim as a defense to a third party using their source code? It is an affirmative defense, you to be able to argue the merits. If you publish their source code, they are allowed to come after you whether they have previously used fair use or not. It's fact specific and determined case by case. Anthropic won half of their fair use argument in the billion dollar settlement, but lost the other half…

claude, please review this source repo and make a new app called 'not-claude-code'

Re: The Claude Code Leak

#174

Post by 112233 »

miki123211 wrote: post #120
Frieren wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are several ways of looking at law and order. One way is that the law applies to everybody equally. That has been the way it works for many years, not perfectly, in democratic countries. There is another way of working were the law is not blind. Laws are applied based in who is the one affected. This is what big tech and the ultra-rich have been advocating for. The law applies differently to nobility and aristo…

A third way of looking at it is that you can't just blindly copy arguments when the situations are clearly different. Nobody, not even Anthropic, is arguing that they should be able to host other people's paid content for free. The crux of their fair-use defense is that models are transformative works, just like parodies or book reviews, and hence should be treated as fair use. You can't just take a pile of books (no…

If lossy-compressed transcodes of ripped movies are not "transformative works" and can get people even jailed, then lossy-compressed text of ripped books and websites is neither.

There is a lot of knowhow going into a good divx rip too, you know.

And it enables so much novel uses such as popcorn time, with fluorishing business opportunities.

You wouldn't download a car. They did.

Re: The Claude Code Leak

#175

Post by lukewarm707 »

jona777than wrote: post #64
leduyquang753 wrote: post #7

> Many software developers have argued that working like a pack of hyenas and shipping hundreds of commits a day without reading your code is an unsustainable way to build valuable software, but this leak suggests that maybe this isn’t true — bad code can build well-regarded products. The product hasn't been around long enough to decide whether such an approach is "sustainable". It is currently in a hype state and ne…

I have flip-flopped more than ever in the last 365 days about prioritizing good code vs good product, in the AI age. This helps clarifies why. I have come to the conclusion that we just do not know yet. There is a part of me that believes there is a point somewhere on the grand scale where the code quality genuinely does not matter if the outcome is reliably and deterministically achieved. (As an image, I like to thi…

it is better for security when code is simple.

i tried using litellm and it was 700mb! it does have a lot of features. postgres db, prometheus, api layer. really complicated. but simple help is missing. it assumes you will put passwords in an env file. how do you add chat completions in the ui? how do you add a custom provider?

but, what i wanted, a simple proxy, can be written in 30 lines of python in fastapi. memory fetch/push in 50 lines. different providers can be added with two lines, one import and one client create.

Re: The Claude Code Leak

#176

Post by croes »

raincole wrote: post #112
croes wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Claude Code 2.0 (and other agent tools) are not expected to be mature. They'll all be obsolete in two or three years, replaced by the next generation of AI tools. Everyone knows that. Claude Code 3.0 (and other agent tools) are not expected to be mature. They'll all be obsolete in two or three years, replaced by the next generation of AI tools. Everyone knows that. And so on and on and on. A promise of AI was mature…

I don't know what your point is. What you said is exactly what I expect to happen, except they might have a more creative name than "Claude Code 2.0".

My point is that the mature version will always be the next future version.

Re: The Claude Code Leak

#177

Post by lelanthran »

UqWBcuFx6NV4r wrote: post #163
lelanthran wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Code doesn't matter IN THE EARLY DAYS. > This is similar to what I've observed over 25 years in the industry. In a startup, the code doesn't really matter; the market fit does. > But as time goes on your codebase has to mature, or else you end up using more and more resources on maintenance rather than innovation. Counterpoint: Code does matter, in the early days too! It matters more after you have PMF, but that do…

Nope. That’s what self-important engineers will tell themselves, but it doesn’t make it remotely true. You’re patting yourself on the back for throwing together a CRUD app and burning through a bajillion dollars on AWS.

>> Counterpoint: Code does matter, in the early days too!

>> It matters more after you have PMF, but that doesn't mean it doesn't matter pre-PMF.

>> After all, the code is a step-by-step list of instructions on solving a specific pain point for a specific target market.

----------------------------------

> Nope. That’s what self-important engineers will tell themselves, but it doesn’t make it remotely true. You’re patting yourself on the back for throwing together a CRUD app and burning through a bajillion dollars on AWS.

Did you perhaps reply to the wrong comment?

Re: The Claude Code Leak

#178

Post by dpark »

benterix wrote: post #136
stbev wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you noticed that comments like "this post seems written with AI" are now appearing on all posts, even those written without AI? We're starting to become wary due to the abuse of AI and proliferation of sloppy content, but also because we often have trouble distinguishing authentic from sloppy content. Another feature of this AI era that I hate.

Yeah, whenever I see "It's not... it's...", I catch myself instinctively dismissing the content as AI slop, but upon reflection I'm not so sure, it used to be a normal phrase. But I do take extra care to avoid LLM-speak as much as I can.

“It's not delivery, it's DiGiorno!” — Probably AI, according to HN commenters

Re: The Claude Code Leak

#179

Post by mergesort »

bostik wrote: post #39
mergesort wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey there, author of the post here! I actually wrote this piece myself on my phone while I was out for a walk this morning. It was initially meant to be a quick note more than a full blog post —- whereas Coding As A Creative Expression took me a couple of days to write. I made a commitment to write more this year and put my thoughts out quicker than I used to, so that’s likely the primary reason it’s not as deep of a…

> wrote this piece myself on my phone while I was out for a walk If you have a strategy for jotting down (or dictating) notes while walking about, I would be curious how you manage that. I spend plenty of time walking outside, and tend to get (at the time) ideas that I'd like to explore further, most of which have evaporated from my mind by the time I get back home. Or even before I can get my phone out to jot down t…

Hey there! I'm not sure I have a universally applicable answer, but I can do my best to map out some things about my process and flow that hopefully help a bit and answer your question.

- I've had an iPhone for half my life (I'm 36 and got one when I was 19), so I've gotten pretty acclimated to typing on the go. I try switching to dictation every couple of months but the iPhone's dictation trips up over enough words that I find it more frustrating than typing as I walk.

- I don't do this but if you're worried about the thoughts disappearing I would absolutely recommend recording a voice note. As I'll touch on in a moment — do not let those thoughts disappear! Even the act of codifying them into something tangible allows you to process them more deeply.

- I live in NYC but I start most mornings by taking a walk along a relatively quiet street, so I rarely end up having to worry about bumping into someone. That is definitely not universally applicable advice. (:

- I look up as I'm typing and let autocorrect take the wheel. That works at least 95% of the time, so if I make the occasional typo it doesn't really matter, I'll just fix it in post.

- It helps to have an app with a great text editing experience. I've found that there are very few out there that are fluid, many have incredibly subtle hitches that make it hard to quickly jot down thoughts onto a canvas. I really love Craft (https://craft.do) and have been using it for years, so at this point it feels more like an extension of me than an app.

- This is surely unique to everyone but my writing tends to start from a few keystone thoughts. Once I have one written down, I let myself almost free associate, writing down whatever comes to mind from that initial thought to make sure I do not forget. I can always edit after the fact, and often the editing process leads to more interesting insights as well. But the main thing I want to avoid is losing those sparks, in the same way that you're mention your thoughts evaporating. Don't let those go, just get 'em on paper and sort through 'em afterwards.

- That's all a lot easier to do on my phone than if I approached the problem as "type an essay on my phone", so I'll almost always edit a post on my computer before publishing. Yesterday was more of an exception than the rule though because I was bouncing around between doctors all day, so I wrote all of this on my phone [not expecting it to blow up or get a ton of scrutiny].

Not sure if anything's missing but I'm happy to share anything that may be helpful! Clearly this post wasn't perfect, but I've been much happier since I started letting myself write out long-form thoughts on my phone and sharing them as blog post rather than firing them off as pithy tweets that decay into the ether once the algorithm says it's time for them to go.

Re: The Claude Code Leak

#180

Post by dpark »

bakugo wrote: post #101
raincole wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps, just perhaps, LLMs are just statistical models that literally can't create novel things, therefore any structure LLMs write was learnt from human writing? But who knows!

What kind of human writing has "it's not X—it's Y" in every single paragraph? The answer is none. LLMs haven't accurately modeled human writing for years, current models have been smacked on the head with the coding RLHF bat so much, they all write distinctly inhuman text.

The thing is, people are screaming “AI” when they see a single “it's not X—it's Y" pattern in a post, despite this being a fairly common construct.

People are nitpicking every tiny thing in their search for proof of AI. It’s not useful and ends up dominating the conversation. AI panic is degrading the value of forums at least as much as actual AI at this point.

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