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ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

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Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#161

Post by sabedevops »

Imnimo wrote: post #149
MyNameIsNickT wrote: post #49

Hey! I'm Nick, and I work on Integrity at OpenAI. These checks are part of how we protect our first-party products from abuse like bots, scraping, fraud, and other attempts to misuse the platform. A big reason we invest in this is because we want to keep free and logged-out access available for more users. My team’s goal is to help make sure the limited GPU resources are going to real users. We also keep a very close…

It's interesting to me that OpenAI considers scraping to be a form of abuse.

Seriously. The hypocrisy is staggering!

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#162

Post by 0x3f »

tshaddox wrote: post #154
0x3f wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meet me in a cafe and I will sign a JWT saying you're not a bot. You can submit this to whoever will accept it.

Doesn’t really make sense, because any service can just say “you must paste your human-attestation JWT here to use this service” and plenty of people will.

You can just decay your trust level based on the `iat` value. That way people will need to keep buying me coffee. I can optionally chide them for giving out their token.

If you're engaging with the idea seriously, I suppose we'd need to build a reputation or trust network or something.

Although if you're talking about replay attacks specifically, there are other crypto based solutions for that.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#163

Post by tshaddox »

lxgr wrote: post #14

It's absurd how unusable Cloudflare is making the web when using a browser or IP address they consider "suspicious". I've lately been drowning in captchas for the crime of using Firefox. All in the interest of "bot protection", of course.

Is anyone talking about the fact that this is a fundamental design flaw of the web? Or arguably even the entire Internet?

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#164

Post by 0dayman »

MyNameIsNickT wrote: post #49

Hey! I'm Nick, and I work on Integrity at OpenAI. These checks are part of how we protect our first-party products from abuse like bots, scraping, fraud, and other attempts to misuse the platform. A big reason we invest in this is because we want to keep free and logged-out access available for more users. My team’s goal is to help make sure the limited GPU resources are going to real users. We also keep a very close…

Hi Nick, your software is a horrendous encroachment on users' privacy and its quality is subpar to those of us who know what we're working with. We don't use your product here.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#165

Post by Arainach »

mzajc wrote: post #109
magicseth wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If apple approves it, ive got a solution: A keyboardthat attests to your humanity https://typed.by/magicseth/2451#2NyGLfAQxmqRiAOTlaX7ma3G4d1o...

Brilliant! Just the thing we want: more hardware attestation, more deanonymization, less user control, all diligently orchestrated in a repository where the only contributor is Anthropic Claude [0]. Comes complete with a misaligned ASCII diagram in the README to show how much effort the humans behind it put in! Yes, even their "humanifesto" is LLM output, and is written almost exclusively in the "it's not X it's Y" s…

> Yes, even their "humanifesto" is LLM output, and is written almost exclusively in the "it's not X it's Y" style.

....no. There's not a single occurrence of that.

https://keywitness.io/manifesto

There are six emdashes on that page. NONE of them are "it's not X it's why".

> Emails, messages, essays, code reviews, love letters — all suspect.

> We believe this can be solved — not by detecting AI, but by proving humanity.

> KeyWitness captures cryptographic proof at the point of input — the keyboard.

> When you seal a message, the keyboard builds a W3C Verifiable Credential — a self-contained proof that can be verified by anyone, anywhere, without trusting us or any central authority.

> That's an alphabet of 774 symbols — each carrying log2(774) ≈ 9.6 bits. 27 emoji for 256 bits.

> They're a declaration: this message was written by a person — one of the diverse, imperfect, irreplaceable humans who still choose to type their own words.

Clarifications: 4

Continuation from a list: 1

Could just be a comma: 1

"It's not X -- it's Y": 0.

If you're going to make lazy commentary about good writing being AI, please at least be sure that you're reading the content and saying accurate things.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#166

Post by 3form »

tshaddox wrote: post #163
lxgr wrote: post #14

It's absurd how unusable Cloudflare is making the web when using a browser or IP address they consider "suspicious". I've lately been drowning in captchas for the crime of using Firefox. All in the interest of "bot protection", of course.

Is anyone talking about the fact that this is a fundamental design flaw of the web? Or arguably even the entire Internet?

It's hard to call something a "fundamental flaw of web" if it wasn't an issue for 30 years. Unless you mean something more general that I'm missing.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#167

Post by salawat »

MyNameIsNickT wrote: post #76
mehov wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> because we want to keep free and logged-out access But don't you run these checks on logged-in users too?

Yep, on logged-in users too. The reason is basically the same: we want scarce compute going to real people, not attackers. Being logged in is one useful signal, but it doesn’t fully prevent automation, account abuse, or other malicious traffic, so we apply protections in both cases.

More like "We want your money, but don't want to provide service." Are you sure OpenAI isn't morphing into a finance/insurance company?

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#168

Post by Velocifyer »

magicseth wrote: post #99
0x3f wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meet me in a cafe and I will sign a JWT saying you're not a bot. You can submit this to whoever will accept it.

If apple approves it, ive got a solution: A keyboardthat attests to your humanity https://typed.by/magicseth/2451#2NyGLfAQxmqRiAOTlaX7ma3G4d1o...

This does not prove anything and it is only avalible to users with X.com accounts (you need a X.com account to download the app).

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#169

Post by hathawsh »

__MatrixMan__ wrote: post #94
jagged-chisel wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like we’re bringing back the PGP key signing parties

The sooner we do the better.

I wonder what the PGP signing concept does to thwart people who want to profit and don't care about the public good. It seems like anyone who attends a signing party can sell their key to the highest bidder, leading to bots and spammers all over again.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#170

Post by technion »

To prompt a discussion that's purely technical: I'm interested in how this was done.

Specifically, Turnstile as far as I'm aware doesn't do anything specifically configurable or site specific. It works on sites that don't run React, and the cookie OpenAI-Sentinel-Turnstile-Token is not a CF cookie.

Did OpenAI somehow do something on their own API that uses data from Turnstile?

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