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My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

tobiasberg.net

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Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#111

Post by an0malous »

wvenable wrote: post #50
MostlyStable wrote: post #42

>Here’s hoping governments regulate laptop manufacturers to actually make repairable machines in the future. No, this is a bad solution. If you want a repairable machine, buy one. They exist. Others have already mentioned Framework, but there are other options that aren't that far down the spectrum either. One of the things macbook users praise the most is "build quality", which often means the solidity of the device…

> No, this is a bad solution. You didn't say why this is a bad solution. The government mandates that cars get safer every year and fatalities are down 78% from the 1960s. Whenever government regulates things to benefit people, people tend to benefit. > One of the things macbook users praise the most is "build quality", which often means the solidity of the device, lack of flex, etc. It seems like the Macbook Neo has…

> You didn't say why this is a bad solution.

The fear is that regulations ossify industries and that's why heavily regulated industries like healthcare, education, and transportation have seen basically no innovation in 50 years. If you mandate that all electronic devices must have USB-C cables, how can anyone invent something better than a USB-C cable? And for what, so people don't have to have multiple cables? That's not even in the top 100 problems that a government body as large as the EU should be concerned about.

> Whenever government regulates things to benefit people, people tend to benefit.

Healthcare, education, transportation, and housing would all be counterexamples depending on how you want to frame "benefit."

> It seems like the Macbook Neo has a lot of those properties as well for a very inexpensive device that is extremely easy to repair.

This is counter to your point, no one regulated that Apple make the MacBook Neo easy to repair. Apple is incentivized to follow the market.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#112

Post by TacticalCoder »

Apple is disgusting from that standpoint. I have my MacBook Air M1's screen break overnight (the "bendgate"), without any reason, after 13 months. I didn't buy the extended two years warranty. I was one-month off warranty. On a MacBook Air M1 I paid something like 1000 EUR VAT included (don't remember the exact price but in that ballpark), they were asking 700 EUR to fix the screen.

I still just ordered a MacMini M4 (I know the M5 is coming but we've got something like 20 computers at home, including servers, NUCs, laptops, desktop, etc. so I may not mind buying a M5).

Still... Apple, from the bottom of my heart: FUCK YOU.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#113

Post by socalgal2 »

MostlyStable wrote: post #42

>Here’s hoping governments regulate laptop manufacturers to actually make repairable machines in the future. No, this is a bad solution. If you want a repairable machine, buy one. They exist. Others have already mentioned Framework, but there are other options that aren't that far down the spectrum either. One of the things macbook users praise the most is "build quality", which often means the solidity of the device…

100% agree. If you don’t like that Apple products are expensive to repair, don’t buy them or suck it up

I came to terms with it, mostly. I buy AppleCare. I’ve had my screen on my M1 Mac replaced twice.

I agree with the sentiment tho. I had the rubber foot come off the bottom of a MacBook Pro, Apple wanted $350 to replace that $1 part. I found other solutions

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#114

Post by GreenVulpine »

MostlyStable wrote: post #42

>Here’s hoping governments regulate laptop manufacturers to actually make repairable machines in the future. No, this is a bad solution. If you want a repairable machine, buy one. They exist. Others have already mentioned Framework, but there are other options that aren't that far down the spectrum either. One of the things macbook users praise the most is "build quality", which often means the solidity of the device…

No. This is a bad solution. You can't blame consumers for not making the right choice when there's a sea of irreparable junk and a few niche repairable options on the market. Reparability should be the default expectation.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#115

Post by Arcuru »

stavros wrote: post #93
VogonPoetry wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That 2mm uses at least (2*335 + 2*235) * 2mm * 1mm = 2,280 mm^3 more material for the case. (a wall thickness of 1mm)

I don't understand your math. The 1mm (the wall) was there already, so why is it being counted here? Plus, multiplying by 1 doesn't do anything? Also, the 2mm extra won't be solid plastic (they'll be solid air, since that's why we're adding the extra thickness, for the room. If anything, the extra material for the case would be the perimeter length times the perimeter wall width times the height.

> If anything, the extra material for the case would be the perimeter length times the perimeter wall width times the height

That's what they did?

Perimeter length = 2*335mm + 2*235mm

Wall height diff = 2mm

Wall width = 1mm

(2*335 + 2*235) * 2mm * 1mm = 2,280 mm^3

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#116

Post by Tade0 »

an0malous wrote: post #111
wvenable wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No, this is a bad solution. You didn't say why this is a bad solution. The government mandates that cars get safer every year and fatalities are down 78% from the 1960s. Whenever government regulates things to benefit people, people tend to benefit. > One of the things macbook users praise the most is "build quality", which often means the solidity of the device, lack of flex, etc. It seems like the Macbook Neo has…

> You didn't say why this is a bad solution. The fear is that regulations ossify industries and that's why heavily regulated industries like healthcare, education, and transportation have seen basically no innovation in 50 years. If you mandate that all electronic devices must have USB-C cables, how can anyone invent something better than a USB-C cable? And for what, so people don't have to have multiple cables? That…

> If you mandate that all electronic devices must have USB-C cables, how can anyone invent something better than a USB-C cable?

That already happened with Micro USB. The EU initially mandated that manufacturers agree on a standard socket, because the absolute zoo of charging ports back then was counter-productive and only generated e-waste. Ultimately they agreed to use Micro USB, but obviously that's not what's used today.

These regulations are not just dumped on the manufacturers - there's a period of consultation and a grace period to implement them. If something actually better came up, you'd eventually see it mandated.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#117

Post by Tade0 »

bluedino wrote: post #102

I thought the keys were replaceable now? (first video I found on a search) https://www.youtube.com/shorts/WYT7YIh00Xk I know in the Butterfly days those keys would break when you removed them.

Far more likely it's an electrical contact issue.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#119

Post by stavros »

Arcuru wrote: post #115
stavros wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand your math. The 1mm (the wall) was there already, so why is it being counted here? Plus, multiplying by 1 doesn't do anything? Also, the 2mm extra won't be solid plastic (they'll be solid air, since that's why we're adding the extra thickness, for the room. If anything, the extra material for the case would be the perimeter length times the perimeter wall width times the height.

> If anything, the extra material for the case would be the perimeter length times the perimeter wall width times the height That's what they did? Perimeter length = 2*335mm + 2*235mm Wall height diff = 2mm Wall width = 1mm (2*335 + 2*235) * 2mm * 1mm = 2,280 mm^3

Ah, thanks, I think what happened was that the asterisks were turned into italics and confused me. I think the message was edited to clarify.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#120

Post by matt-attack »

wvenable wrote: post #50
MostlyStable wrote: post #42

>Here’s hoping governments regulate laptop manufacturers to actually make repairable machines in the future. No, this is a bad solution. If you want a repairable machine, buy one. They exist. Others have already mentioned Framework, but there are other options that aren't that far down the spectrum either. One of the things macbook users praise the most is "build quality", which often means the solidity of the device…

> No, this is a bad solution. You didn't say why this is a bad solution. The government mandates that cars get safer every year and fatalities are down 78% from the 1960s. Whenever government regulates things to benefit people, people tend to benefit. > One of the things macbook users praise the most is "build quality", which often means the solidity of the device, lack of flex, etc. It seems like the Macbook Neo has…

Do you have a reference for the neo being easy to repair? Is this regarding the keyboard? Or the whole thing?
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