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Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

androidauthority.com

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Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#131

Post by kivle »

AlBugdy wrote: post #25

What's the phone OS landscape now? What can someone who values their agency and wants FOSS choose? * iOS - walled garden, so no * Android: * * with a Google account and Play Services - a bit less of a walled garden, but still no * * Android without Google: * * * GrapheneOS - root or adb not supported, so no * * * LineageOS - (edit: root or adb not supported, so no - just learned) seems like a viable option although i…

I had the first two iPhone models, but then moved to Android. So I've been an Android user for ~15 years. This will probably be the drop that makes me go back and try an iPhone again. If all phone OSes are going to be walled gardens, might as well go for the best one.

Android has always been lagging on usability/performance/polish, but I stuck with it for the openness and because it generally was first to tryi new things. I remember how people at work laughed at me when I got a Samsung Galaxy Note ("It's so big it looks like you have an iPad in your pocket"), yet a few years later every phone was that size. And now Android is leading with foldables. I love my OnePlus Open, but OnePlus seems to be pulling out from the Western market so further support is looking "iffy", so might as well get an iPhone.

Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#132

Post by rudhdb773b »

PufPufPuf wrote: post #42
AlBugdy wrote: post #25

What's the phone OS landscape now? What can someone who values their agency and wants FOSS choose? * iOS - walled garden, so no * Android: * * with a Google account and Play Services - a bit less of a walled garden, but still no * * Android without Google: * * * GrapheneOS - root or adb not supported, so no * * * LineageOS - (edit: root or adb not supported, so no - just learned) seems like a viable option although i…

Why do you want to root? I didn't really feel the need for the past few years.

Backing up all app data.

Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#133

Post by tasuki »

Zak wrote: post #7

It's a very small concession. The high initial friction still means when someone comes to me with a problem and I tell them the solution is in F-Droid, they have to wait a day. Most give up and pick a different, less trustworthy solution from Google Play.

> have to wait a day

The horrors!

Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#134

Post by Taterr »

procaryote wrote: post #113
Taterr wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand usually the megacorporation is simply being anti-consumer with these kinds of changes, and who knows maybe this is the same. But I think this might be an actual exception. They seem to be actually implementing a lot of high effort scam protection features recently in android so unless they did all of that just as an excuse to make side loading harder then they've fooled me. https://security.googleblog.co…

It's pretty easy to make up a reasonable sounding excuse for something you do for your own profit as a company. If they don't even provide any statistic on how frequent these scams are, it can be just words Also, if your bank 2fa code is in your notifications, you should switch 2fa methods to something other than sms, or switch banks.

So we should just accept that all apps must treat android notifications as a compromised communication channel?

The scammers will find some other way to abuse the very generous permissions allowed by an android app if you prevent the notification attack.

Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#135

Post by xigoi »

ChocolateGod wrote: post #130
xigoi wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google’s perspective is that they don’t want people to install NewPipe so that the CEO can buy more yachts.

I would bet the amount of people getting scammed is probably higher than those installing NewPipe.

The difference is that Google doesn’t mind scam apps being on the Play Store.

Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#136

Post by em-bee »

this is awesome! because i get a new phone every week, this will save me so much time.

WAT? how is that even better than the ability to skip the wait time?

you are right, i am not seriously bothered by the wait time, i'd just activate it on a new phone, wait a day and be done with it. i have had to wait two weeks to unlock a xiaomi phone, so this is not that of a big deal. (besides i am not going to be affected anyways because i use a custom rom, but that's besides the point. let's assume i will be affected)

who changes their phone so often that being able to carry over the setting to skip the wait is a win?

i am embarrassed that i fell for this article, believing that there would actually be a genuine improvement to sideloading.

Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#137

Post by rcxdude »

Taterr wrote: post #103
schubidubiduba wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does nobody ever think of the poor megacorporation? I mean maybe you're even right and they care a little bit about people being scammed. But if you believe that the scamming thing is any more than a pretense for further establishing Google's absolute control over the Android ecosystem, that is just very naive. Their goal is to make money. Apps installed outside of Google mean less money for them. Ergo, consumer'…

I understand usually the megacorporation is simply being anti-consumer with these kinds of changes, and who knows maybe this is the same. But I think this might be an actual exception. They seem to be actually implementing a lot of high effort scam protection features recently in android so unless they did all of that just as an excuse to make side loading harder then they've fooled me. https://security.googleblog.co…

I wouldn't be surprised if the people at google implementing this genuinely believe this to be the case. It was the same thing with AMP, the people doing it really seemed to believe it was entirely a good thing and there were no negative consequences whatsoever. But it doesn't really matter when the thing also blatantly concentrates power within themselves that can later be used to their own interests.

(Here's another reason it's a bad idea: scammers tend to be very good at navigating the roadblocks you put in to do a thing, often moreso than the people who legitimately want to do the thing, so I wouldn't be surprised if the scammers still have a healthy supply of malicious apps now signed by google. If they can't keep malware off of the play store where they see the malicious code, why do they think they can stop scammers registering as developers to sign their malware?)

Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#138

Post by metalman »

Guggle et all, are starting to panick, as the whole adversurvielance scam is unraveling, there is NO concievable end game. The surviving frogs, having been cooked en mass are getting ready to spontainiously evolve, AI is destroying vulnerable peoples ability to make descisions and the knock on effects as basic infrastucture erodes while costs spiral and actual knowledge is lost, but AI will be cheering them on by telling them walking and chewing gum are seperate activities that should be scheduled sequentialy after rest periods.

Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#139

Post by rcxdude »

Taterr wrote: post #111
vanviegen wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look at the attack vectors that are actually being used, and address them specifically, with minimally invasive measures. If the problem is apps that allow remote control of your device, that people can be socially engineered into installing, put up barriers to gaining just that permissions. That approach would actually help motivate the problem (as scammers can now just use Google-approved apps for such things). If…

I am quite genuinely curious what you think the best solution to prevent someone instructing a tech illiterate person over the phone to click through every permission warning about a malicious app they're installing is? No amount of scary menus will work. I feel like they only have 2 options, which is to limit some permissions without any exceptions (making their platform more closed), or make it harder to install ap…

I think it's a problem where the only solutions are worse, on the whole, than the disease.

Probably the best option would be the ability to lock down your own device somehow (i.e. put the toggle in the opposite direction by default). This at least lets others around someone vulnerable to this protect them (and probably much more effectively, as the controls can be a lot tighter than 'we once saw an ID we believed was real')

Re: Android’s new sideload settings will carry over to new devices

#140

Post by phendrenad2 »

Google is going to keep tweaking this because they have two conflicting goals. They want to cut off alternative app stores where they don't get their 30% cut, and they absolutely do not want to push people to other operating systems like graphene etc. They need it to be very high friction to accomplish the former, but if they make it too high-friction they'll trigger the latter. It's a catch-22, and they're going to dither in an infinite loop.
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