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Olympic Committee bars transgender athletes from women’s events

nytimes.com

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Re: Olympic Committee bars transgender athletes from women’s events

#41

Post by egypturnash »

happymellon wrote: post #9

Has anyone measured trans athletes performance? I see this topic come up repeatedly in different guises, protect women from the evil trans-agenda. But I haven't seen where this is actually a problem. Do trans-athletes regularly out perform "born as" (not sure the best way to phrase it) athletes?

"born as" (not sure the best way to phrase it)

The usual term is "cisgender", or "cis" for short.

"Cis" and "Trans" both come from Latin; the former means "the same side of" and the latter means "the other side of". If you are happy to be on the same side of the gender binary as what you were assigned when you were born then you are "cisgender"; if you are unhappy with that state of affairs (regardless of how much work you have put into changing it) then you are "transgender".

Re: Olympic Committee bars transgender athletes from women’s events

#42

Post by manwe150 »

VirusNewbie wrote: post #31
tensor wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To educate others reading this, it's far from "obvious" how to classify gender in sports. Checking if they have the right "parts" physically doesn't do it. Checking for hormone levels doesn't do it. Even checking for Y chromosomes doesn't do it. In my opinion the way forward is to stop trying to find arbitrary ways to define gender, and just start making competition classes based on whatever factors are relevant to t…

>checking for Y chromosomes doesn't do it Lol why does this not do it?

Because in a specific minority of the population it disagrees with the gender assigned at birth for obvious reasons. There are plenty of resources you could read on intersex instead of lol at something you don’t understand

Re: Olympic Committee bars transgender athletes from women’s events

#43

Post by tensor »

putzdown wrote: post #33
tensor wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To educate others reading this, it's far from "obvious" how to classify gender in sports. Checking if they have the right "parts" physically doesn't do it. Checking for hormone levels doesn't do it. Even checking for Y chromosomes doesn't do it. In my opinion the way forward is to stop trying to find arbitrary ways to define gender, and just start making competition classes based on whatever factors are relevant to t…

Why is checking for a Y chromosome not sufficient? This does not seem to me like an arbitrary definition. What am I missing?

It's in fact possible to develop a female body with XY chromosomes:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6586948/

Also warning that article has images that may be inappropriate in a public setting. I didn't realize when I linked it.

Re: Olympic Committee bars transgender athletes from women’s events

#44

Post by reillyse »

changoplatanero wrote: post #15

I thought this article does a good job explaining why some people care a lot about this topic https://www.theargumentmag.com/p/how-youth-sports-supercharg...

The problem for this argument is that there is no actual data that trans kids and specifically trans girls are any better at sport than other girls.

Literally no trans athletes winning anything. I think hacker news skews scientific so we can do the math, if say 1% of the athletes are trans we would expect them to win 1% of the medals in a fair contest. As it is, they don't even come anywhere close. There has not been a single olympic medal won by a trans athlete, so clearly they do not have some kind of magical advantage, in fact (and common sense would make this pretty obvious) they seem to have quite a statistical disadvantage.

Re: Olympic Committee bars transgender athletes from women’s events

#45

Post by beachWholesaleS »

lelanthran wrote: post #13
happymellon wrote: post #9

Has anyone measured trans athletes performance? I see this topic come up repeatedly in different guises, protect women from the evil trans-agenda. But I haven't seen where this is actually a problem. Do trans-athletes regularly out perform "born as" (not sure the best way to phrase it) athletes?

> Do trans-athletes regularly out perform "born as" (not sure the best way to phrase it) athletes? Regularly. It's the competing women who are complaining, though. They feel it is unfair to compete with men.

Source?

Re: Olympic Committee bars transgender athletes from women’s events

#46

Post by lelanthran »

happymellon wrote: post #19
lelanthran wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do trans-athletes regularly out perform "born as" (not sure the best way to phrase it) athletes? Regularly. It's the competing women who are complaining, though. They feel it is unfair to compete with men.

Citation? I asked because I'm curious, and Googling just gives opinion pieces and not data. [Edit] Currently -3 but no study referenced. Do people just not like the idea of providing evidence for their position? The women I've spoken to about this article cite men being the problem, whether its sexual harassment, or other sexist attitudes. Not one felt that trans participation in their sport of choice was in their to…

> I asked because I'm curious, and Googling just gives opinion pieces and not data.

Women complaining are voicing an opinion. Is this a good enough citation for the claim that women don't want to compete with men?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gndSDgsMnKI

Re: Olympic Committee bars transgender athletes from women’s events

#48

Post by dragonwriter »

happymellon wrote: post #9

Has anyone measured trans athletes performance? I see this topic come up repeatedly in different guises, protect women from the evil trans-agenda. But I haven't seen where this is actually a problem. Do trans-athletes regularly out perform "born as" (not sure the best way to phrase it) athletes?

> Do trans-athletes regularly out perform "born as" (not sure the best way to phrase it) athletes?

No, both because there are very few trans athletes in competition, and because trans athletes (except trans women who have not started or are less than a year into hormone therapy) have net athletic disadvantages, when considering all factors relevant to performance in almost any real sport, compared to cisgender people of the same gender identity.

I mean, if you had a sport that isolated grip strength alone, trans women would have an advantage over cis women, but aside from rather contrived cases like that, they don't.

There's a reason the poster woman for the political movement around this in the US is a cisgender woman whose story of "unfair competition" is tying with a trans woman for fifth place behind four other cisgender women (and having to hold a sixth place trophy in photos, since there were not duplicates on hand for the same rank) in an intercollegiate swimming competition.

Re: Olympic Committee bars transgender athletes from women’s events

#50

Post by LunicLynx »

happymellon wrote: post #19
lelanthran wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do trans-athletes regularly out perform "born as" (not sure the best way to phrase it) athletes? Regularly. It's the competing women who are complaining, though. They feel it is unfair to compete with men.

Citation? I asked because I'm curious, and Googling just gives opinion pieces and not data. [Edit] Currently -3 but no study referenced. Do people just not like the idea of providing evidence for their position? The women I've spoken to about this article cite men being the problem, whether its sexual harassment, or other sexist attitudes. Not one felt that trans participation in their sport of choice was in their to…

This is more about logic.

For this article to be relevant a spot for the Olympics of either gender has been taken by a trans athlete.

Which by conclusion means that a trans person outperformed the other gender.

Taking part in the Olympics is a difficult endeavor, for which you must qualify first.

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