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Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

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Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#221

Post by markb139 »

colechristensen wrote: post #121
bluGill wrote: post #27

I used to work for a company that made third party scan tools. We had racks of ecus disconnected from the car with just a diagnostic connector and power. nothing got to a real car without first trying it on the rack. I remember on time we figured out a bmw (pre obdii) had the bytes offset from the standard documentation (it was a semi-standard protocol that some other cars used at the time), we went from we communica…

I spent the last week successfully reverse engineering my car / various scan tools to get the right information to diagnose a fuel pump problem (and to do so without the incredible awkwardness of many of the tools) It's pretty amazing what Claude + Ghidra + knowledgable coaching can accomplish. It was basically just setting direction, setting up an incremental workflow with the right kind of documentation, and questi…

I’ve recently built a disassembler and emulator using Claude to help reverse engineer a 90’s ECU based on an Intel embedded cpu. It was quite impressive to watch when Claude started to use the emulator to help understand how bits of the code worked.

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#222

Post by bluGill »

ErroneousBosh wrote: post #206
bluGill wrote: post #27

I used to work for a company that made third party scan tools. We had racks of ecus disconnected from the car with just a diagnostic connector and power. nothing got to a real car without first trying it on the rack. I remember on time we figured out a bmw (pre obdii) had the bytes offset from the standard documentation (it was a semi-standard protocol that some other cars used at the time), we went from we communica…

You don't know anything about late-90s Lucas/SAGEM GEMS ECUs do you, or Range Rover BeCMs? I'm currently picking apart the firmware in those because it is now impossible to get replacement ignition key fobs, and it just can't be that difficult...

It was 16 years ago, and I only worked with what got to the US. I don't remember much and not those at all. I saw a few how to program key fob documents but we decided that was a dealer service and so I never implemented it. still generally just send the right 4-8 bytes and press a button on the fob in a minute. In any case it sounds like you want a different end: making a fob or bypassing them was never something I got anything on.

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#223

Post by Phelinofist »

guyzero wrote: post #50

Congrats, OP has recreated a test/development bench, the bane of developers working on automotive software development all around the world. They're so close to being a real vehicle that you think you'll be able to get a lot of work done, but they're not, so you don't.

Can confirm. We are required to test all of our stuff on a bench, but no one really trusts this, because everything is mocked anyway (RSI).

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#224

Post by thegreatpeter »

AbanoubRodolf wrote: post #167
jordanb wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Researchers who find at least one valid “rooting” vulnerability will receive a permanent SSH certificate for their own car It feels like this is something you should get by being owner of the car, and not have to do free speculative research for the manufacturer to get it.

[flagged]

Tesla’s manuals are all online and many of the parts sell for cost plus. You may be thinking of Ford and Toyota

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#225

Post by malwrar »

tenthirtyam wrote: post #220
jordanb wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Researchers who find at least one valid “rooting” vulnerability will receive a permanent SSH certificate for their own car It feels like this is something you should get by being owner of the car, and not have to do free speculative research for the manufacturer to get it.

In most cases I agree with this, but maybe not for potentially dangerous things like cars? What if someone roots into their car and disables some essential safety feature - maybe even a legally mandated safety feature? More concretely, the expertise-required-to-access-root is in a different field to the expertise-required-to-make-wise-changes. i.e. you might know how to hack a car, but that doesn't mean you know how…

People have been modifying their cars since cars have existed, an electric car shouldn’t be anything new.

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#226

Post by bluGill »

jcgrillo wrote: post #140
bluGill wrote: post #27

I used to work for a company that made third party scan tools. We had racks of ecus disconnected from the car with just a diagnostic connector and power. nothing got to a real car without first trying it on the rack. I remember on time we figured out a bmw (pre obdii) had the bytes offset from the standard documentation (it was a semi-standard protocol that some other cars used at the time), we went from we communica…

That's super cool, I'm currently struggling with scan tools for a 1999 Mercedes E300 Turbodiesel. I had one that worked OK for about a decade (Autel something or other) with a 38pin connector, but it recently bricked itself with a message like "connect via USB to Updata" which I assume means its firmware somehow erased itself. Cannot figure out how to "updata" it, doesn't seem to connect via USB, the Autel software r…

I remember getting that era working. I concluded Mercedes was trying to be clever in making a protocol so complex nobody else could understand it (thus ensuring you had to use a dealer) - and then discovered they couldn't debug it.

each body model (nothing to do with year or style) was different so clearing dtc but nothing else is not a surprise.

i did get that working, but I last touched it in 2007 so I don't remember enough details to be helpful. good luck.

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#227

Post by AndroidKitKat »

nishanseal wrote: post #124

This is awesome. Curious if these are plug and play and if that's the case where is the memory that tells you what the mileage is. If it's attached to the computer than the mileage would be off if you switch/repair it. Completely unrelated. Would be interested if you figure out how to retrofit the new adaptive shocks on performance models to the older cars. Something I would love to do if I had hobby time. I'm pretty…

You can, at the very least, retrofit the Juniper suspension onto the old car [1]. I haven't ridden in the new Performance yet, but I recently got a 2026 Model Y and the suspension is night and day compared to my 2024.

[1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EahoyTgkkyU

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#228

Post by fluoridation »

AbanoubRodolf wrote: post #167
jordanb wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Researchers who find at least one valid “rooting” vulnerability will receive a permanent SSH certificate for their own car It feels like this is something you should get by being owner of the car, and not have to do free speculative research for the manufacturer to get it.

[flagged]

>The underlying tension is that "you own the car" means something very different from "you own the software running the car."

What does that mean? "The software" is a specific configuration of the hardware you own. How can you own the hardware and not the specific copy of whatever data is on it? Note that I'm not confusing the copy of the data with the IP rights to it.

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#229

Post by mikegreenberg »

malwrar wrote: post #225
tenthirtyam wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In most cases I agree with this, but maybe not for potentially dangerous things like cars? What if someone roots into their car and disables some essential safety feature - maybe even a legally mandated safety feature? More concretely, the expertise-required-to-access-root is in a different field to the expertise-required-to-make-wise-changes. i.e. you might know how to hack a car, but that doesn't mean you know how…

People have been modifying their cars since cars have existed, an electric car shouldn’t be anything new.

Given electric cars are responsible for much bigger responsibilities than combustion cars (avoid driving into that bicyclist), there are new concerns here which beg extra consideration.

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#230

Post by pta2002 »

jabedude wrote: post #131

I'm actually somewhat surprised the OS fully boots when it's not connected to the expected vehicle peripherals

I work on automotive software (not Tesla), and it's like this partially because it makes development _way easier_. Rather than needing to get a whole car to the dev team, you just give them the specific part that they're working on. Anything that needs outside features usually just fails gracefully (e.g. no speedometer or no location for maps). These are usually mocked for testing, or you add the specific ECU that provides it for your testing setup if needed.

Modern cars have tens of ECUs, so if you had to have all of them for testing, that would get unwieldy extremely quickly. Not to mention that cars are pretty resilient to having random parts failing, you don't want to lose the entire dashboard just because the ECU that provides camera data failed, or something.

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