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Apple randomly closes bug reports unless you "verify" the bug remains unfixed

lapcatsoftware.com

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Re: Apple randomly closes bug reports unless you "verify" the bug remains unfixed

#201

Post by dbg31415 »

Good news -- you can do this too! https://github.com/actions/stale

Seriously, auto-closing issues that haven't seen activity in 3–6 months is one of the best things you can do for your project.

If nobody's touched it in that long, it's time to accept it's never getting prioritized -- it's just collecting dust and making your backlog feel way heavier than it actually is.

So let it go. Let it go! (It feels good to channel your inner Elsa!)

A clean backlog is a healthy backlog. You'll actually be able to find the stuff people care about instead of wading through years of noise. And if something truly matters? Don't worry... those issues come back, they always do.

Re: Apple randomly closes bug reports unless you "verify" the bug remains unfixed

#202

Post by calmingsolitude »

afdbcreid wrote: post #109
masklinn wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Author must not have worked in enterprise software before. Or with open source projects. Fucking stalebot.

As an open source maintainer, I feel that statement is really unfair. Yes, we do sometimes close bug reports without evidence they are fixed. But: - We owe you nothing! And the fact that people still expect maintainers to work for them is really sad, IMHO. - Unlike corporate workers, nobody is measuring our productivity therefore we have no incentive to close issues if we believe they are unfixed. That means that whe…

IMO closing issues via stale bot is fine, the problem is locking issues so that no further conversation is allowed on the issue. Multiple times, I've encountered multi-year old issues (which is usually not fixed due to the fix not being simple or compatible with the current architecture). There's usually a good amount of conversation between users offering workarounds (and those workarounds updated for newer versions) - till stale bot locks the issue.

Re: Apple randomly closes bug reports unless you "verify" the bug remains unfixed

#204

Post by nradov »

daheza wrote: post #191
nradov wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I've found to be most effective for program management is to set aside a maintenance team separate from the feature teams. The roadmap is then planned without counting anything for the maintenance team and they deal with bug tickets as they come in. Rotate the assignment periodically so that every developer has to occasionally spend a few months on the maintenance team.

Doesn’t this lead to problems like the feature team pushing buggy code and having no accountability or responsibility to deal with it? My preference is to treat the defects like feature work, size and plan. Yes you might not get all the feature work done but the team is accountable for everything they make

There's a lot more to effective program quality management than I can explain in a comment here. Forcing all developers to rotate through the maintenance team is one incentive not to ship crap because they might end up having to deal with it anyway. But more importantly you have to shift left the quality assurance and control activities to minimize the risk of defect leakage in the first place. And set up a closed-loop system where any leaked defect triggers a rigorous root-cause analysis that results in further process improvement.

Re: Apple randomly closes bug reports unless you "verify" the bug remains unfixed

#205

Post by bloppe »

deathanatos wrote: post #184
thewebguyd wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they basically insist that I become an unpaid systems engineering QC person Microsoft support is guilty of this, especially for Azure & 365 issues. Like sorry, but you aren't paying me to debug your software. Here's a report, and here's proof of me reproducing the problem & some logs. That's all I'm going to provide. It's your software, you debug it.

While I'd love to take your tack, unfortunately, I find that if I actually want the fix, I have to become their unpaid engineer. Which is ridiculous, because at the same time my company is paying a separate support fee, large enough to literally employ a dedicated engineer for my company!

It makes a lot of sense. I would also try to get my customers to do work for me if I were confident they would never churn.

Re: Apple randomly closes bug reports unless you "verify" the bug remains unfixed

#206

Post by AnonC »

> Why do I file bug reports with Apple Feedback Assistant? I plead insanity.

As do I.

> In the three years since I filed the bug report, I received no response whatsoever from Apple… until a couple of weeks ago, when Apple asked me to “verify” the issue with macOS 26.4 beta 4 and update my bug report.

The author is extremely lucky to even get a response. I’ve filed several issue reports (as an end user, not as a developer) on Feedback Assistant over the years. Not only do the issues not get fixed, but there’s nary a response or any indication that anyone has looked or is planning to look at it. Apple does not even bother to close my issue reports. They just stay open.

Sometimes, some issues may get fixed. But no notice of the fix being done. I’d never know at all.

So yes, I certainly do plead insanity.

Re: Apple randomly closes bug reports unless you "verify" the bug remains unfixed

#207

Post by toast0 »

CoolGuySteve wrote: post #144
lapcat wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What specifically do you claim I'm making up?

That the ~50000 engineers at Apple are conspiring to close your tickets in the exact same way. It's ridiculous

> That the ~50000 engineers at Apple are conspiring to close your tickets in the exact same way. It's ridiculou

It's pretty clear from experience that the organization policy is to not provide feedback on bug submissions. Getting a 'check it if still reproduces or we'll close it in two weeks' message after 3 years is actually a fast turnaround.

Best I've gotten was on an issue I routed to a friend who worked at Apple who promised it would get looked at, but that I wouldn't hear back.

Microsoft wouldn't fix my issues either, but at least they got back to me in a timely fashion. Usually telling me it was a known issue that they weren't going to fix.

Re: Apple randomly closes bug reports unless you "verify" the bug remains unfixed

#208

Post by AnonC »

jen729w wrote: post #200

The experience is similar if you call for end-user support. I did this once with an Apple Home issue. I called 133-MAC (Australia), got through to someone immediately , had a nice chat, was very impressed, felt supported, and got myself a case number. Of course, it wasn't resolved. And then, no matter what I did, I could never, ever get a single word out of anyone about that case again. I often wonder if it's still o…

I had an even more time consuming experience like this. I worked with Apple Support over the phone for a few months. They had me install a profile on the iPhone to collect more diagnostic logs, had me perform various steps to reproduce the issue, followed up for more information, etc. After a few months, the person assigned to the case went on vacation or something and another person was assigned. Coincidentally, it was getting closer to a new iOS release date. My whole case went completely dead and there was no way to revive it.

Re: Apple randomly closes bug reports unless you "verify" the bug remains unfixed

#209

Post by toast0 »

bloppe wrote: post #205
deathanatos wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I'd love to take your tack, unfortunately, I find that if I actually want the fix, I have to become their unpaid engineer. Which is ridiculous, because at the same time my company is paying a separate support fee, large enough to literally employ a dedicated engineer for my company!

It makes a lot of sense. I would also try to get my customers to do work for me if I were confident they would never churn.

I will do the work for them (typically paid for by my employer) iff I can expect them to fix it.

Blackbox debugging is a PITA, which is part of why I prefer open source, but it is what it is... If something is broken, and I can get it fixed by putting in the time to get a good report, and etc and they fix the thing, then I'll do it.

But if they don't fix the stuff, I have no shortage of things to fix myself.

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