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Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

bugs.xdavidhu.me

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Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#91

Post by denysvitali »

dwa3592 wrote: post #63

Interesting. > A REST-like API on :8080 which returned a history of “tasks” I am curious to know what kind of historical tasks- since it's a media control unit; does it show what kind of media was being played in the last trip? does it reveal any other info about the driver?? There might be a privacy angle here that you could exploit and share it with Tesla.

They hit Odin. Odin is the diagnostic tool of Tesla. The tasks they've seen are like "TEST_BRAKE_X_STIFFNESS-TEST-PRESSURE-BURNISHED" and are used to test different components of the car. They're also used for example to reset FSD strikes.

In Tesla terms, the infotainment does much more than just playing music - it has full access to the rest of the car.

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#92

Post by incrediblylarge »

juleiie wrote: post #84
acuozzo wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Software people tend to overestimate their knowledge of other disciplines, writing it off as "easy" or work beneath them You should see what happens when someone involved in the sciences, e.g. Chemistry, gets their hands on Claude Code.

What happens?

A professional scientist I know (tenured, professor) recruited me to set up a backtesting framework for a predictive finance model. When the results were not as they expected (this person does not work in finance and never has), they asked to see the code, then told me that claude had found a problem with the way some of the calculations were done (there was actually no problem), supplied the claude comments, and told me to change the code to match what they thought was correct. I did it anyway. Had they had more expertise in the domain (finance), they likely would have been able to leverage claude as a tool rather than inadvertently pursuing a very stupid mistake. Domain experts tend to doubt their ability to excel in other domains which is amplified by LLMs.

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#94

Post by kotaKat »

kube-system wrote: post #43
MBCook wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will say I’m surprised how far apart the two boxes are in the car. I guess they’re not where I thought. I would assume they’re both up near the dash.

The passenger side kick panel or behind the glove box are two very common places for vehicle computers -- some cars have them under the hood, which I always thought was a bad idea.

If you'd like the cursed location for a vehicle computer, have the Smart fortwo's SAM. It's the fuse box!

It's also notorious for having awful solder connections and failing outright.

https://evilution.co.uk/mod/sam-unit-solder-repair.htm (and Aging Wheels: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8AAleKR33Q)

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#95

Post by denysvitali »

0xbadcafebee wrote: post #42

> Unfortunately I had no other choice but to buy this entire loom for 80 USD. Fwiw, mine costs $450 from Ford. Also in the US we call this a wiring harness, with the loom being the material that goes over the wires

That particular statement is also wrong. For this particular setup you can also buy the correct cable (making sure to not get the one that inverts some pins!!!) for cheaper. Mine was around 15$.

Violet HSD Code D 4+2 Pin Female to D Female Jack Connector 6 Pin HSD LVDS High Speed DataTransmission Harness Wire LVDS Cable https://a.aliexpress.com/_EuGOh9e

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#96

Post by desmondwillow »

longislandguido wrote: post #58
kube-system wrote: post #13

> Turns out that actual cars don’t have individual cables. Instead they have these big “looms”, which bundle many cables from a nearby area into a single harness. This is the reason why I could not find the individual cable earlier. They simply don’t manufacture it. I was really surprised to read this at the end of the article -- how could someone be this deep into a project of this depth and not realize this?! Not o…

Software people tend to overestimate their knowledge of other disciplines, writing it off as "easy" or work beneath them. Being overpaid compared to your peers certainly doesn't help dispel this feeling. Some people have built entire careers around designing wire looms.

Consider whether this is an uncharitable comment --- someone with little expertise in a discipline has made a rookie mistake and didn't realize that the wires weren't produced individually.

Professionals overestimating their knowledge is a very common thing!

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#97

Post by NamlchakKhandro »

moomoo11 wrote: post #77
kube-system wrote: post #13

> Turns out that actual cars don’t have individual cables. Instead they have these big “looms”, which bundle many cables from a nearby area into a single harness. This is the reason why I could not find the individual cable earlier. They simply don’t manufacture it. I was really surprised to read this at the end of the article -- how could someone be this deep into a project of this depth and not realize this?! Not o…

I'm sure you're an expert, pro at everything.

Yes I am. Thankyou for recognising that

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#98

Post by budman1 »

duskwuff wrote: post #54
a1o wrote: post #48

> A DC power supply capable of providing 12V Hey, I just remembered my school used to have ages ago some cool power supplies (I think from Agilent?) that were very idiot proof, they had current limit with a dial that I think didn’t went over 1A or perhaps even less, and they would instantly disarm on short circuit (and indicate it with a led), and also the voltage dial I think wouldn’t go over 25V. I remember it was…

What you're describing is a lab power supply. (The "instantly disarm on short circuit" is overcurrent protection, which is a standard feature.) The name brands like Keysight or Rigol are kind of expensive, but there are a lot of no-name models on Amazon which will do the job well enough.

Keysight == Hewlett-Packard Old School.

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#99

Post by varenc »

From the article

> Tesla offers a “Root access program” on their bug bounty program. Researchers who find at least one valid “rooting” vulnerability will receive a permanent SSH certificate for their own car, allowing them to log in as root and continue their research further.

Pretty interesting. Sounds like Apple's Security Research Device Program[0], where you're loaned a rooted iPhone, but with a clear qualification criteria.

It strikes a nice balance, because to qualify you have to 1) show you have the skills to get root access anyway and 2) show you're willing to participate in the bug bounty program and get things patched.

I would of course love root on everything I own, but I can understand Tesla's motivation here since root for everyone would make vulnerability discovery easier for malicious actors. And if everyone had root on their Tesla, it'd be much easier to make naughty modifications that might catch the ire of regulators. (like disabling driver attentiveness checks in self-driving mode).

[0] https://security.apple.com/research-device/

Re: Running Tesla Model 3's computer on my desk using parts from crashed cars

#100

Post by msisk6 »

yearolinuxdsktp wrote: post #87
msisk6 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My RAM truck with the Cummins diesel engine has the engine computer mounted on the engine block. You'd think the heat and exposure to the elements would make that a bad idea, but I suppose Cummins knows what they're doing.

Yes they do. They can tolerate engine bay heat, but not exhaust heat. They are usually shielded from getting soaked. Some Mazdas put the metal-cased engine computer in a plastic air box that feeds cold air from the front, to help ensure the engine computer stays cool enough. In general, I believe the cooling airflow from the frontal air and the cooling fans keeps engine bay in check. For example, this is the board th…

Yeah, on the Cummins the ECU is mounted on the intake side of the engine away from the exhaust and turbo and toward the front right under the fuel injection pump so it gets lots of cooling air.

This thread is interesting to me 'cause I'm also a software guy and recently took a job dealing with building fighter jets and the amount of engineering going into the wiring and computers on those things is insane. It's been a very interesting learning experience.

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