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Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

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Re: Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

#301

Post by Lazare »

JasonADrury wrote: post #72
nailer wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The linked blog contains a story about who funds archive today and they presumably don’t like being exposed.

[flagged]

> Jani Patokallio runs gyrovague.net in order to harass people who provide useful public services.

I mean...investigating who runs secretive yet popular websites is a useful public service, generally called "journalism". And your comments in this thread could be seen as an attempt to harass Jani.

I do not, to be clear, think you're doing anything morally wrong, but I'm also not sure I see how you can draw a bright line between your actions and Jani's. By the rather stretched logic and loose standards you've been using in these comments, it seems like you run your HN account to harass people who provide useful public services, no?

Re: Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

#302

Post by smohare »

dddgghhbbfblk wrote: post #216
JasonADrury wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jani Patokallio who runs gyrovague.com published a blog post attempting to dox the owner of archive.today. Jani justifies his doxing as follows "I found it curious that we know so little about this widely-used service, so I dug into it" [1] Archive.today on the other hand is a charitable archival project offered to the public for free. The operator of Archive.today risks significant legal liability, but still offers…

>It's weird to see people getting fixated on the DDoS, which is obviously far less nasty than actually attempting to dox someone. I would say the opposite... The DDoS is pretty obviously ridiculous, completely unacceptable, and entirely indefensible, while the blog post seems like whatever. I honestly cannot fathom defending using your popular website as a tool to DDoS someone you have personal beef with, without the…

[dead]

Re: Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

#304

Post by razingeden »

akerl_ wrote: post #5
razingeden wrote: post #3

Cloudflare dns has gone back and forth on whether it wants to resolve them since 2019. It’s taken that away and restored it again (intentionally? mistake?) at least four times. The c&c/botnet designation would seem to be new though.

Have they? The thing I remember previously was archive.is, and it wasn’t a block, archive.is was serving intentionally wrong responses to queries from cloudflare’s resolvers. This is notably not a change to how 1.1.1.1 works, it’s specifically their filtered resolution product. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19828702

Thank you. And all. It’s too late to edit my comment but the ones in this vein checked out and I stand corrected

Re: Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

#305

Post by JasonADrury »

Permit wrote: post #272
JasonADrury wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how this description changes the fundamental nature of your actions. Even a half-assed attempt at doxing is still an attempt at doxing. It'd be much easier to accept that you're acting in good faith had you deleted the post when it became obvious that the target doesn't appreciate it. You could still do that, and it would very simply be the right thing to do.

You are attempting to perform a rhetorical sleight of hand here. You are well aware that linking to a Stack Exchange post and running WHOIS is not grounds for a DDoS as a measured response. In light of this fact, you attempt to portray it as “doxxing” to mislead people into thinking that someone’s identity or address was published against their will. I encourage everyone to read the original article and make their ow…

[flagged]

Re: Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

#306

Post by JasonADrury »

bastawhiz wrote: post #222
JasonADrury wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how this description changes the fundamental nature of your actions. Even a half-assed attempt at doxing is still an attempt at doxing. It'd be much easier to accept that you're acting in good faith had you deleted the post when it became obvious that the target doesn't appreciate it. You could still do that, and it would very simply be the right thing to do.

You've thoroughly discredited yourself and your other comments with this. If anything, this comment reads exactly like the messages from the archive.today operator. No sensible person could read the original blog post and read this comment as anything other than an attempt to spread lies and pressure Jani.

[flagged]

Re: Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

#307

Post by JasonADrury »

Lazare wrote: post #300
JasonADrury wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how this description changes the fundamental nature of your actions. Even a half-assed attempt at doxing is still an attempt at doxing. It'd be much easier to accept that you're acting in good faith had you deleted the post when it became obvious that the target doesn't appreciate it. You could still do that, and it would very simply be the right thing to do.

I'm absolutely open to the argument that Jani has does something wrong, but nothing you've said has really even accused them of anything. If you want to define doxing narrowly (as it was historically) then I would agree that all (or nearly all) such cases are wrong, but this is by no means clearly doxing. If you want to define doxing widely (as is common lately), then I'll accept this is clearly an example of doxing,…

We called this exact pattern of behaviour "doxing" on IRC in the early 2000s, I really don't know why you think I'm using some new definition.

It's probable that in the later 00s this would have been called a "faildox", but it's still just a fundamentally dick move to try to identify someone online who doesn't want to be identified. It doesn't matter if you do a completely shit job at it.

Re: Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

#308

Post by JasonADrury »

bastawhiz wrote: post #224
croes wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t doxxing most of the time just collecting data from multiple public sources and connect them?

How low has the bar gotten where doxxing is literally just doing a Google search and a whois lookup about a well-used public website? The hackers of the 90s and aughts would laugh you straight out of the irc server with this comment.

Nonsense, by the mid-aughts google searches and whois lookups were key tools for doxing. If you had been around in the hacker scene at that time, you'd be well aware instead of trying to inject fabricated mystique.

Re: Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

#309

Post by JasonADrury »

Aurornis wrote: post #255
JasonADrury wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jani Patokallio who runs gyrovague.com published a blog post attempting to dox the owner of archive.today. Jani justifies his doxing as follows "I found it curious that we know so little about this widely-used service, so I dug into it" [1] Archive.today on the other hand is a charitable archival project offered to the public for free. The operator of Archive.today risks significant legal liability, but still offers…

> It's weird to see people getting fixated on the DDoS, The weird part to me is that some people are seemingly trying to downplay a popular website abusing visitors to DDoS someone. How does your information (two angles) change anything at all about that fact? Normally if any website was caught abusing visitors to DDoS another website there would be no debate about why this is a bad thing. What about your other angle…

>The weird part to me is that some people are seemingly trying to downplay a popular website abusing visitors to DDoS someone.

What's the true, practical impact being downplayed here?

Re: Cloudflare flags archive.today as "C&C/Botnet"; no longer resolves via 1.1.1.2

#310

Post by _osud »

pschastain wrote: post #293
JasonADrury wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Archive.org has an even worse history of this, FWIW. It allows website owners and third parties to tamper with archived content. Look here, for example: https://web.archive.org/web/20140701040026/http://echo.msk.r... Archive.today is by far the best option available.

Deflection rather than addressing the actual accusation Pay attention to this type of behavior, folks. It's revealing

What do you want me to address? I'm just pointing out that there are no great archival services, and the only real alternative to archive.today is worse.

>Pay attention to this type of behavior, folks. It's revealing

What does it reveal?

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