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Having Kids (2019)

paulgraham.com

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Re: Having Kids (2019)

#251

Post by coneonthefloor »

tavavex wrote: post #239

> On the other hand, what kind of wimpy ambition do you have if it won't survive having kids? Do you have so little to spare? I don't know, it seems like parenthood asks for a lot to be given up. Younger people like myself are already struggling to live on their own where I am. There's not a lot that can be spared by most of us. To me, having a child means heavily straining your financial safety - here, care for this…

You exist solely to procreate.

I could not imagine an emptier life, than one without children.

Re: Having Kids (2019)

#252

Post by artyom »

Daneel_ wrote: post #11

I also had kids, and while I love my kids I haven’t loved spending time with my kids. This will hopefully change as they age, but the first six years have so far been very much a drag on my life and productivity, and not much else. They haven’t provided fulfilment, and they haven’t provided satisfaction. Some joy is there from time to time, definitely, but nothing in the way the author describes. Happiness for me typ…

You're not alone and I'll even say this is evolutionary.

Men haven't evolved to be overly attached to babies or small kids like mothers did - that'd have been a weakness in the survival race. Men skills were completely different, usually related to being away from the kids most of the time.

Translate to modern day, that is men not really wanting to have kids (sometimes just going along with the wife's biological clock), and pretty much "feeling nothing" when the kids are born. There's a million documented examples of that.

However, once kids leave the "little puppy" phase and grow beyond the basic needs care that mothers provide, it's when the fathers start to really relate to them.

If your older kid is maybe 5-6 you're about to start that new phase. That's what happened to me, and I find (maybe not so extreme) examples of that on almost every guy I talk to.

Give it a second chance, maybe having kids is just not for you. But don't assume it's already the case, you may miss out whole new world.

Re: Having Kids (2019)

#253

Post by liveoneggs »

neonnoodle wrote: post #205

I often wonder in these threads what proportion of the commenters is male. HN skews heavily male, and statistically speaking, fathers are spared a huge chunk of the physical and mental burdens of pregnancy, birth, and parenting. Being a mom and being a dad are not equivalent, and I have a feeling that not many male HNers would readily swap places if such thing were possible.

Isn't it convenient that nature has already placed us in our respective roles and given us the necessary strengths to handle our different but equally important roles?

It's such a tragedy that one might feel compelled to weigh the burdens of motherhood vs fatherhood as if either side had a choice in the matter or as if there is some kind of competition to be won.

Re: Having Kids (2019)

#254

Post by vladgur »

tavavex wrote: post #239

> On the other hand, what kind of wimpy ambition do you have if it won't survive having kids? Do you have so little to spare? I don't know, it seems like parenthood asks for a lot to be given up. Younger people like myself are already struggling to live on their own where I am. There's not a lot that can be spared by most of us. To me, having a child means heavily straining your financial safety - here, care for this…

The best thing our(I’m in US) society can do to dispel fears like yours is to offer public daycare where kids are well cared for and socialized.

I’m a child of Soviet Era and our parents did not think twice if they can afford children with their meager salaries. I remember going to a kindergarten as soon as I could walk.

The reality is that a family can always make choices that enable them to care for a kid, but there are of course trade offs.

Public daycare would mitigate one of those trade offs

Re: Having Kids (2019)

#255

Post by InexSquirrel »

tayo42 wrote: post #52
jasonkester wrote: post #22

Before having kids, I expected it to be this huge life changing thing. That it would effectively end the part of my life where I was free to do whatever I wanted, and start the part where I was just Daddy, doing nothing except serving my childrens' needs. But that didn't happen. We just carried on being Jason and his partner, but with a baby in tow. I had spent most of my 30s cramming in as much "living" as possible,…

Travel with a baby isn't that bad. I think people struggle with losing their identity when they no longer get long periods of focus time or can participate in their hobbies with the dedication they would like.

It can be. And it also places strain on the people around you too if the kid isn't settled and easy to travel with.

Not the kids fault, but last time I travelled, there was a couple travelling with a child that was crying, hysterically the entire trip. This was a 20 hour trip all up, from NZ to SA, crossing NZ to AU then to SA, and they were with us all the way. The kid was going for the entire thing - I watched the parents take turns to look after her, standing near the toilets. I feel sorry for them having to deal with that, and for the girl being that upset (presumably sore ears? dunno), but that would not have been fun for the people around them either.

I was always super wary of travelling with ours in case that happened. We were lucky that they just slept through all the flights, but it could have easily gone the other way. I would have felt pretty stink subjecting the surrounding 40+ people to a very upset child.

Re: Having Kids (2019)

#256

Post by diehunde »

Such a corny take. People should have kids when they know for sure they want to become parents. If they are unsure because the life they want for themselves seems incompatible, then it becomes a gamble. So many miserable parents out there who hide their experiences because they are afraid of social punishment or because they need to convince themselves that this permanent life-altering decision was the right one. That's my take as someone who for 35 years didn't want kids and one day woke up knowing for sure I wanted a kid in my family.

Re: Having Kids (2019)

#257

Post by dismalaf »

drfloyd51 wrote: post #14

Before kids it was easy to judge bad parents. Then one day with child I found myself due to circumstances in a store way past my child’s bedtime. She was screaming and crying, because it was way past her bedtime. Then I realized… I was now “the bad parent” I had so easily judged. Then it was easy to judge parents with children younger than mine. Until I learned that not all children have the same issues in the same o…

Dunno, I didn't judge before having a kid. After having a kid, it's 100x easier than people made it out to be and it's hard not to judge.

Re: Having Kids (2019)

#258

Post by redwood »

diehunde wrote: post #256

Such a corny take. People should have kids when they know for sure they want to become parents. If they are unsure because the life they want for themselves seems incompatible, then it becomes a gamble. So many miserable parents out there who hide their experiences because they are afraid of social punishment or because they need to convince themselves that this permanent life-altering decision was the right one. Tha…

Do you honestly think those miserable parents stay miserable for the long term or might that be a temporary bump in the ride?

Re: Having Kids (2019)

#259

Post by redwood »

dismalaf wrote: post #257
drfloyd51 wrote: post #14

Before kids it was easy to judge bad parents. Then one day with child I found myself due to circumstances in a store way past my child’s bedtime. She was screaming and crying, because it was way past her bedtime. Then I realized… I was now “the bad parent” I had so easily judged. Then it was easy to judge parents with children younger than mine. Until I learned that not all children have the same issues in the same o…

Dunno, I didn't judge before having a kid. After having a kid, it's 100x easier than people made it out to be and it's hard not to judge.

Maybe your kid is easier than most.. I would not generalize

Re: Having Kids (2019)

#260

Post by strangegecko »

coneonthefloor wrote: post #251
tavavex wrote: post #239

> On the other hand, what kind of wimpy ambition do you have if it won't survive having kids? Do you have so little to spare? I don't know, it seems like parenthood asks for a lot to be given up. Younger people like myself are already struggling to live on their own where I am. There's not a lot that can be spared by most of us. To me, having a child means heavily straining your financial safety - here, care for this…

You exist solely to procreate. I could not imagine an emptier life, than one without children.

I reject your premise, but your conclusion is not surprising considering it.

I couldn't imagine an emptier life than one where the only thing that matters is procreation. We're not Pacific Salmon.

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