Earlier quoted context omitted.
what's your solution to combat scammers?
[flagged]
I wonder whether scammers will switch to using PWA.
Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
441–450 of 1001 posts
Re: Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
#442> In addition to the advanced flow we’re building free, limited distribution accounts for students and hobbyists. This allows you to share apps with a small group (up to 20 devices) without needing to provide a government-issued ID or pay a registration fee. I don't quite understand how those installs would be tracked. If I create a "hobbyist" account and share the apk, are the devices that install that app all repor…
With this change, Android will not just send every app install to Google, but even require approval from Google before allowing app installs.
Re: Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
#443This is going to hurt legitimate sideloading way more than actually necessary to reduce scams: - Must enable developer mode -- some apps (e.g., banking apps) will refuse to operate and such when developer mode is on, and so if you depend on such apps, I guess you just can't sideload? - One-day (day!!!) waiting period to activate (one-time) -- the vast majority of people who need to sideload something will probably no…
> - Must enable developer mode -- some apps (e.g., banking apps) will refuse to operate and such when developer mode is on, and so if you depend on such apps, I guess you just can't sideload? What apps are those? I've yet to run into any of my banking apps that refuse to run with developer mode enabled. I've seen a few that do that for rooted phones but that's a different story. I've been running android for a decade…
Philippines' most popular e-wallet app GCash outright closes when the developer mode is enabled with the popup saying that the device has "settings [enabled] that are not secure".
Re: Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
#444Earlier quoted context omitted.
This has nothing to do with keeping people safe. If it did then power users could continue to install their own software by being given that ability as a developer setting. The fact that some people are gullible enough to go into a hidden setting on their phone and enable that in order to install an app from a random Chinese website is not a good reason to take away everyone's freedom. Consolidation of power is all t…
There is immense pressure to stop online scams which are draining old people of their life savings. The whole flow from the article seems entirely based around letting power users install what they want while being able to break the flow of a scammer guiding a clueless person in to installing malware. It is promising that Google has avoided just turning off sideloading but still put measures in place to protect peopl…
Why is it on Google to stop this and not the banks?
Re: Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
#44524H forced wait time?!? WTF When I side-load open-source apps for other people, I want to do it right in the moment, not activate the feature, and the next time I see them (like half a year later), install the app. When Google announced there would be an alternative installation method, I did not expect such a mess...
So it seems it will work as they intended.
"I did not expect such a mess", I certainly did. Another arm of the push to remove anonymity online.
Re: Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
#446The goal seems to be breaking the real-time guidance scammers rely on. 24h probably works, but it feels like a heavy tradeoff for legit users.
Scammers will just start the process and call back the next day. There is an entire genre of scam relying on slowly building rapport and only cashing in once all the way at the end.
Exactly, it will have 0 effect on scammers. It is primarily made to piss off people and make it more difficult to install independent free software.
Re: Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
#447The "protective waiting period" of 24h is what kills it. For people like me, who rely more and more every day on OSS apps not necessarily in the Play Store, installing a new phone will mean waiting a full day for almighty Google to allow me to do so. It reminds me of the same annoyance of carrier phone unlocks. I wonder how this will play out in the phones coming out of the Motorola+GrapheneOS partnership.
A minuscule amount of nerds being slightly annoyed is definitely worth when it hinders scammers from ruining a persons live.
There's no way this is really about scammers. I have never heard of scammers pushing sideloaded apps upon their victims in order to carry out their scams.
Would welcome evidence to the contrary. Is this truly a threat model that's seen in the wild?
My gut says no because social engineering is about hijacking legitimate, first-party processes. Scammers attack login credentials, MFA flows, and use first-party apps to maintain access (think remote control software like TeamViewer). These apps come from the Play Store, not from meticulously curated collections like F-Droid, and not from somebody pressuring you to sideload an APK.
And if scammers decide to use sideloading as an attack vector -- then like all the other security gates that can be defeated via social engineering, I expect they will find an end-run around this one as well. Either on a technical basis, or by social-engineering users into bumbling past it and on to the next stage of the scam.
Build an idiot-proof system and society will build a better idiot. And yeah, the rest of us only wind up slightly annoyed, _for now_, until Google tightens their grip further on some other flimsy pretext.
Re: Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
#448'Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.' - Benjamin Franklin
Re: Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
#449The part in the flow where you select between allowing app installs for 7 days or forever is a glimpse into the future. That toggle shows the thought process that's going on at Google. I can bet that a few versions down the line, the "Not recommended" option of allowing installs indefinitely will become so not recommended that they'll remove it outright. Then shrink the 7 day window to 3 days or less. Or only give us…
what's your solution to combat scammers?
Tell the unsophisticated users that they would be safer inside the ecosystem that has always been a walled garden.
Why destroy the ecosystem that gives you the freedom to shoot yourself in the foot?
Turning Android into another walled garden removes user choice from the equation.
Re: Google details new 24-hour process to sideload unverified Android apps
#450Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Ruining Android for everyone Are they really though? does the average person really care about side loading? I think we are in an echo chamber. I can't picture any of the people in my life installing things from outside of an app store on their phone. However I realize that's purely anecdotal, it would be nice to see actual statistics on this to have a more informed decision.
When I point out that Apple listened to the Chinese government and removed apps that protestors were using to communicate during the Hong Kong protests, they seem to get it.
They removed VPNs at the request of the Russian government too (they have no operations in Russia). They are actively participating in government censorship.