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FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

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Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#151

Post by wolvoleo »

anonymars wrote: post #145
inetknght wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luckily I don't work for an ad-supported business.

How did your company and its customers find each other?

Do people really still think advertising has a legitimate function?

Really these days it's 95% psychological manipulation to get people to buy inferior quality stuff they don't need. And 5% of people actually finding what they're looking for.

Don't forget, most advertising can work fine in a "pull" mode. I need something so I go out and look for it. These days something like Google (not ideal because results also manipulated by the highest bidder). Or I look for dedicated forums or a subreddit for real people's experiences. In the old days it would have been yellow pages or ask a friend.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#152

Post by godelski »

lmeyerov wrote: post #116
cheriot wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm game for throwing rocks at Apple and Google, but I don't get this one. > consumer apps embed ad SDKs → those SDKs feed location signals into RTB ad exchanges → surveillance-oriented firms sit in the RTB pipeline and harvest bid request data even without winning auctions Would you ban ad supported apps? Assuming the comment you're responding to is realistic, I'm not sure how the OS is to blame.

You can trace the big players If Google & Apple & friends refused to take a rake and opened distribution, then I'd agree, net neutrality etc, not their problem But they own so much, and so deep into the pipeline, and explain their fees to courts because "security"... and then don't do investigations. They employ some of the best security analysts in the world and have $10-30B/yr revenue tied to just the app store fee…

  > They employ some of the best security analysts in the world and have $10-30B/yr revenue
I'll never not be impressed by how many people will defend trillion dollar organizations and say that things are too expensive. Especially when open source projects (including forks!) implement such features.

I'm completely with you, they could do these things if they wanted to. They have the money. They have the manpower. It is just a matter of priority. And we need to be honest, they're spending larger amounts on slop than actual fixes or even making their products better (for the user).

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#153

Post by fn-mote »

wittyusername wrote: post #29
FL4TLiN3 wrote: post #20

Who's selling the data is the far more serious issue here. Behind this is a remarkably well-structured syndicate. The supply chain looks something like this: consumer apps embed ad SDKs → those SDKs feed location signals into RTB ad exchanges → surveillance-oriented firms sit in the RTB pipeline and harvest bid request data even without winning auctions → that data flows to aggregators who don't have any direct relat…

I find myself uninstalling every app unless I really need it and use it. It's amazing how many apps just sit around in your life over time. get them off your phone

I’m not opening it… can it do anything on iOS?

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#154

Post by AngryData »

FL4TLiN3 wrote: post #20

Who's selling the data is the far more serious issue here. Behind this is a remarkably well-structured syndicate. The supply chain looks something like this: consumer apps embed ad SDKs → those SDKs feed location signals into RTB ad exchanges → surveillance-oriented firms sit in the RTB pipeline and harvest bid request data even without winning auctions → that data flows to aggregators who don't have any direct relat…

I don't think either issue is above one or another. Its problematic to build such databases, and it is problematic that the government is buying these services despite being forbidden from doing it themselves. Being able to buy it is a huge loophole and they all know it is a loophole and is breaking the spirit of the law.

Its like saying murder is illegal but hiring a hitman perfectly legal. Its bullshit and everyone involved in these decisions should be in jail. There is no way anybody working for the FBI can claim ignorance to the constitution.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#155

Post by AngryData »

givemeethekeys wrote: post #2

That's the job of the FBI - to investigate domestic crimes. But, why do private organizations so willingly participate in the tracking ecosystem? I suppose they're in the, "you have nothing to worry about if you're not doing anything illegal" camp! Hopefully they understand that they have the most to lose.

If this kind of surveillance is part of their job, why are they constitutionally forbidden from doing the surveillance themselves?

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#156

Post by AngryData »

saltyoldman wrote: post #52
mhurron wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it is not the job of the FBI to to conduct mass surveillance of citizens.

What if an investigation is based on finding the same specific people near another specific person that they're tracking, but they only know about the one person, not the others. And by doing this they stop a terror attack? One more thought - if they buy just data for specific people related to an investigation, the seller of the data is tipped off. If they just buy all the data, then there is no potential tip-off to…

You can justify anything and everything, including torturing random innocent civilians for information, under the guise of preventing terror attacks. Which is why it is a bullshit excuse.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#157

Post by AngryData »

shermantanktop wrote: post #97

In the US we live in a bizarre world of dual expectations. The government is supposed to follow the law, be accountable, transparent, and must operate within a constrained, circumscribed zone of activity which is debated and discussed. That's at least how it's supposed to work. Private companies are understood as amoral sharks who have no obligation to do anything other than operate in their narrowest self-interest,…

The US is SUPPOSE to do that, but I have yet to see it do any of those things with anything close to regularity or consistency at any point in living memory.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#158

Post by AngryData »

nullcathedral wrote: post #28

Yikes. Why are private organizations so happy to participate in mass surveillance.

Because capitalism would happily burn the world to ash if the capitalists thought it would make them richer. It makes them think they are winning at life.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#159

Post by rexpop »

saltyoldman wrote: post #52
mhurron wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it is not the job of the FBI to to conduct mass surveillance of citizens.

What if an investigation is based on finding the same specific people near another specific person that they're tracking, but they only know about the one person, not the others. And by doing this they stop a terror attack? One more thought - if they buy just data for specific people related to an investigation, the seller of the data is tipped off. If they just buy all the data, then there is no potential tip-off to…

[dead]

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#160

Post by AngryData »

josefritzishere wrote: post #5

A generation ago our leaders derided China (and Russia) for this kind of pervasive spying on it's citizens. In the US we did the same thing just increasing costs by enriching the private sector on the way. That's not better. That's worse.

People still say the same thing today. They just claim "its different" when it is used against them because scary China bad.
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