One way intelligence manifests itself is through the ability to score well in an IQ test. Another way is through the ability to make an impact on the world. But I think another really strong characteristic of intelligent people is their tendency to lead a rich inner life. I get the strong impression most people go about their business without ever really thinking about how incredible it is that the universe not only exists but contains (at extremely low density) sentient beings capable of reasoning about it. Being one of those sentient beings is a remarkable stroke of luck. Intelligent people recognise that and celebrate accordingly.
My IQ
211–220 of 294 posts
Re: My IQ
#212Great insight. Regarding Mensa itself, or any claims to intellectual superiority: one of the big lessons of my life has been that being intelligent has no intrinsic value. If you are unable to manifest your intelligence in a way that can substantially (disproportionate to your effort) improve your life or the lives of others, then your mind doesn't matter. It has no impact in the world, and I am not the first person…
I find interesting the backlash against those who may have any interest in knowing their IQ, or god-forbid even feel good about it. What your anecdotes tell me is not that IQ itself is meaningless, but that success has a large factor of luck involved. It's a failing of our society that genuinely high IQ people are not out there working to improve the lot of mankind. This growing trend of derision for those who acknow…
If you think that "high IQ" and "genuinely intelligent" are the same thing, you are sadly mistaken.
Granted, IQ is correlated with intelligence. But there are lots of undeniably intelligent people who do not have remarkable IQs (eg Richard Feynman would not qualify for MENSA). Conversely your average MENSA chapter is full of people with undeniably high IQs and little sign of remarkable intelligence.
(Disclaimer. Based on my GRE scores, my IQ is about 1/10,000. Based on my experiences in the real world, I believe myself to be intelligent, but nowhere near what that hypothetical IQ score claims. I've always considered MENSA membership to be a filter for people whose only biggest accomplishment is a good score on an IQ test...)
Re: My IQ
#213I don't think that "creative" people would fail the test. Creativity has nothing to do with finding smartass solutions to puzzles. It has little to do with even solving puzzles.
Creativity is seeing, connecting and coming up with things other people don't. The main prerequisite is usually grunt work. We only see the results, not the messy process behind James Dyson's vacuum cleaner with thousands of prototypes, or Bob Noyce's integrated circuit. What made him so creative was his knowledge and understanding of the world of semiconductors and the ability to question things.
I strongly believe that any inventor with a similar story would score high on an IQ tests and would not manifest his creativity by making up unlikely theories. Admittedly, its a sign of intelligence to understand the question and the context in which it is being asked. The world is full of opportunities to show ones creativity. Picking one of 4 answers in a test is not one of those.
Re: My IQ
#214Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's interesting. I'm an LSAT instructor. My first reaction to reading the instructor's comment was, 'Ha, only 165, he's no genius'. But, MENSA accepts 163 as a cutoff LSAT score for entry. So if MENSA == genius, then he is a genius. Among people who take the LSAT though, he's only 92nd percentile. He doesn't have much business teaching the test. Anyone who's at an Ivy League law school has a better score than him.…
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It's right there in the second section of the list.
Re: My IQ
#215Great insight. Regarding Mensa itself, or any claims to intellectual superiority: one of the big lessons of my life has been that being intelligent has no intrinsic value. If you are unable to manifest your intelligence in a way that can substantially (disproportionate to your effort) improve your life or the lives of others, then your mind doesn't matter. It has no impact in the world, and I am not the first person…
That's interesting. I'm an LSAT instructor. My first reaction to reading the instructor's comment was, 'Ha, only 165, he's no genius'. But, MENSA accepts 163 as a cutoff LSAT score for entry. So if MENSA == genius, then he is a genius. Among people who take the LSAT though, he's only 92nd percentile. He doesn't have much business teaching the test. Anyone who's at an Ivy League law school has a better score than him.…
I don't think of MENSA == genius. More like the top 5% in smarts. True geniuses IMO are much rarer.
Re: My IQ
#216Great insight. Regarding Mensa itself, or any claims to intellectual superiority: one of the big lessons of my life has been that being intelligent has no intrinsic value. If you are unable to manifest your intelligence in a way that can substantially (disproportionate to your effort) improve your life or the lives of others, then your mind doesn't matter. It has no impact in the world, and I am not the first person…
> if nobody is forced to contend with your mind, nobody knows it exists.
I'm sure this has already been explored somewhere, but I've always wondered what it says about us as humans that we consider our lives in isolation to be meaningless, but put a bunch of meaningless people together into a society, and impacting them becomes very meaningful. What's going on here, synergy?
Re: My IQ
#217Great insight. Regarding Mensa itself, or any claims to intellectual superiority: one of the big lessons of my life has been that being intelligent has no intrinsic value. If you are unable to manifest your intelligence in a way that can substantially (disproportionate to your effort) improve your life or the lives of others, then your mind doesn't matter. It has no impact in the world, and I am not the first person…
being intelligent has no intrinsic value Loving what we are has to be worth something, or why bother with progress?
So if you suffered a brain injury, would you love yourself less?
Re: My IQ
#218Yes, yes, a thousand times yes. Years ago in our 20s my wife and I took an IQ test. I think she got in the 150s and I scored in the upper 140s. But I felt I had done much better. When we looked at the scores, for several answers I had results that were clearly consistent with an internal model I could build of the problem, but it just wasn't the model the tester wanted. So in a geometric progression, I noticed that e…
A properly _standardised_ test should at least have been administered to enough people that you were in the minority of the kind of people it was standardised against. Actually, a properly standardised test should have discarded questions like that if their answers weren’t reliable. In any case, it is quite unlikely that the test you took could reliably distinguish between scores above 145.
Couldn't you argue part of the test is whether the test taker can determine the test maker's thinking? ;-)
Re: My IQ
#219Great insight. Regarding Mensa itself, or any claims to intellectual superiority: one of the big lessons of my life has been that being intelligent has no intrinsic value. If you are unable to manifest your intelligence in a way that can substantially (disproportionate to your effort) improve your life or the lives of others, then your mind doesn't matter. It has no impact in the world, and I am not the first person…
It seems like a lot of people over think intelligence and success. Properly balanced or even an excess of serotonin and norepinephrine are what primarily ensures survival and procreation, which generally translates into happiness and sufficient wealth. Trying to measure and identify abstract cognitive ability like IQ tests do is almost somewhat of an autism spectrum-esque devotion. While some smart men and women may contribute greatly to society it's unusual for it to be a personal victory or indeed be as significant as dozens of better predictors of personal trajectory. Over-thinking things may even position excess cognitive function as a net negative drag on success.
Re: My IQ
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
I find interesting the backlash against those who may have any interest in knowing their IQ, or god-forbid even feel good about it. What your anecdotes tell me is not that IQ itself is meaningless, but that success has a large factor of luck involved. It's a failing of our society that genuinely high IQ people are not out there working to improve the lot of mankind. This growing trend of derision for those who acknow…
> It's a failing of our society that genuinely high IQ people are not out there working to improve the lot of mankind. Or maybe it's a failing of those high IQ people? The genius who proudly saves the codebase at Zynga every single day is completely useless compared to any single nurse working her shift right now. Even the doctor at the top of the hospital does not necessarily have a stellar IQ. What other way is the…
>Should we feel bad for smart people because society tricks them into financial services rather than less-paid cancer research?
No, we should feel ashamed that we've created a society where the brightest are funneled into financial services. We should feel utterly devastated that we let genius wallow in menial jobs. It is a failing of the system at every level that these people fall through the cracks and end up doing nothing with their gifts.
Raw intelligence is a resource that society should work hard to 'exploit'. Sure doctors and nurses save a lot of lives and that doesn't necessarily require genius. But compared to, say, the guy who discovered the double-helix structure of DNA, their impact on humanity doesn't even come close.