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Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

ilga.gov

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Re: Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

#311

Post by Dylan16807 »

PostOnce wrote: post #288
Dylan16807 wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So which situation do you want instead of anonymous age verification: A) 18+ content is behind a pinky swear B) 18+ content is behind a parental control (what this bill would do) C) The internet can't have 18+ content anymore D) Some other system? Please describe it.

What about every other system where we rely on parents to parent? Kids can turn apple juice into wine in their closet they can drive their bicycle to a drug dealer they can rub a butter knife against the sidewalk until it's pointy Do we need govt AI cameras in kids closets and on their bicycles? How do we verify they're cycling somewhere safe? How do we make sure they're not getting shitfaced on bootleg hooch they ma…

This is more like a store being able to see their age just by looking at them, and make restrictions because of that. We don't rely on parents to prevent a 10 year old from going into a bar.

Re: Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

#312

Post by Dylan16807 »

davidhyde wrote: post #294
Dylan16807 wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So which situation do you want instead of anonymous age verification: A) 18+ content is behind a pinky swear B) 18+ content is behind a parental control (what this bill would do) C) The internet can't have 18+ content anymore D) Some other system? Please describe it.

D) Parenting

I think parents should have access to easy to operate parental controls to help them do their parenting.

Re: Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

#313

Post by pstuart »

ToucanLoucan wrote: post #263
mgulick wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The power of correlating your real ID with your browsing activity on the internet.

I mean, as much as I don't want the Government to be able to do that, I don't want private industry to be able to do that even more tbh. Though both options are pretty horrendous privacy-wise.

Until recently I felt the opposite way -- what they could do with that was more targeted advertising. The government currently in power is demonstrating that they can do far worse, and plans to.

Re: Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

#315

Post by jacobgkau »

MarsIronPI wrote: post #302
jacobgkau wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I already responded to what you're saying in my initial comment. I'll expand for you. > The fact that they won't even though there are (non-required!) tools they could be using to do so is baffling to me. My parents set me up with an AOL account when we first got a computer and dial-up internet. At first, I was kind of required to go through the AOL desktop application to browse the web since that's how we connected…

OK, I'm going to ask a potentially-dumb question: why are we trying to stop kids who want porn from getting it? As I see it, part of parenting should be telling your children what's not good for them and why. As a kid, if I had seen a case of beer left out I wouldn't have gotten drunk because I wouldn't have wanted to. Likewise I wouldn't have gone to porn sites because I wouldn't have wanted to.

> As I see it, part of parenting should be telling your children what's not good for them and why.

We tell our kids that smoking is bad for them. It's still illegal to sell cigarettes to minors.

> As a kid, if I had seen a case of beer left out I wouldn't have gotten drunk because I wouldn't have wanted to.

Good for you, and neither would I, but that's because I'm a wet blanket (still don't drink today). Selling alcohol to kids and teenagers is still illegal.

Re: Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

#316

Post by fn-mote »

gruez wrote: post #65
tyre wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could require government ID to sign up and an adult sponsor to certify accounts for kids. Plus a limit on how many accounts an adult can sponsor. It would be a mess, but solve the problem. It’s not that we don’t have the technology, we just don’t want to because the friction would decimate user numbers and engagement; it would be much simpler to regulate (e.g. usage limits on minors); and minors are less monetiz…

>They could require government ID to sign up and an adult sponsor to certify accounts for kids. Plus a limit on how many accounts an adult can sponsor. Requiring all online account creation to go through some government vouching system sounds far worse for privacy than OS doing age verification.

The points: 1. No new law is required, FB could do this voluntarily. 2. Meta has a vested interest in a low-friction solution that maintains engagement.

Re: Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

#317

Post by SoftTalker »

pianoben wrote: post #296
jacobgkau wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If parents want drug stores to not sell liquor to their kids, then the proper thing is for someone to build that solution and make a fortune selling it, IMO." See how that makes zero sense in the context of a society? Content providers are not incentivized to care about the problem, and will serve any content with ads next to it that they can unless they are forced not to. Ad-hoc solutions attempting to paper over t…

I don't see the incongruity. It's one thing to mandate that retailers not sell alcohol to children, but it's quite another to require that all computers must report on the identities of their users just so that children don't see porn. The proper analogy would be require verification on the part of the porn sellers.

This bill doesn't require reporting identities. It requires that computers be able to communicate "this is a child" to websites, social media platforms, and apps.

Re: Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

#318

Post by jacobgkau »

pianoben wrote: post #296
jacobgkau wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If parents want drug stores to not sell liquor to their kids, then the proper thing is for someone to build that solution and make a fortune selling it, IMO." See how that makes zero sense in the context of a society? Content providers are not incentivized to care about the problem, and will serve any content with ads next to it that they can unless they are forced not to. Ad-hoc solutions attempting to paper over t…

I don't see the incongruity. It's one thing to mandate that retailers not sell alcohol to children, but it's quite another to require that all computers must report on the identities of their users just so that children don't see porn. The proper analogy would be require verification on the part of the porn sellers.

> all computers must report on the identities of their users

Literally not what's happening with these bills. There is no identity, you would only have to type in a valid date (and nobody's forcing you at gunpoint to make it your actual birth date).

> The proper analogy would be require verification on the part of the porn sellers.

Red states tried that first, and it was very poorly received by the left and the porn industry, among other parties. Asking anonymously at the device level and leaving it to parents to enforce it is more privacy-respecting and less of a burden to adults. Which is exactly why blue states are now trying to do it this way (and is one of the reasons why Aylo & others have been asking for it to be done this way, with the other reason being it's also easier & cheaper on their end).

Re: Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

#319

Post by matheusmoreira »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #251
pianoben wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, and hear me out, _maybe our computers shouldn't spy on us in the first place_?

So which situation do you want instead of anonymous age verification: A) 18+ content is behind a pinky swear B) 18+ content is behind a parental control (what this bill would do) C) The internet can't have 18+ content anymore D) Some other system? Please describe it.

D) Parents take sole responsibility for this.

Re: Illinois Introducing Operating System Account Age Bill

#320

Post by longislandguido »

anthk wrote: post #17

Read and share "Free Software, Free Society" now. Richard Stallman advised us about it long ago. Thank god Plan9 got relicensed into GPL. 9front might not totally free, but it's a step in case GNU+Linux gets utterly broken. And, yes, please, go try Trisquel (novice users), GUIX (experts) and Hyperbola (experts and protocol purists). Avoid every Google, Amazon, Facebook, Apple, Netflix service with nonfree JS.

The pragmatic Richard that wrote that book is long gone I'm afraid.

Today his blog is filled with weird rants against voter ID, the Iran conflict, and a list of other countries he dislikes because they have national ID cards and this is a bad thing apparently.

For someone who is a renowned world traveler, you would think he has heard of passports by now.

Not a peep about these bills that could have a very real impact on an operating system he invented (gah-noo).

Then again, since he's never installed it himself*, account creation is not something he would have to deal with or care about.

* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umQL37AC_YM

Maybe the solution is as simple as having an adult create your account for you.

Like paying a homeless guy to buy you booze or cigarettes, not that anyone would ever do that.

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