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Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

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Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

#181

Post by lurker14 »

laumars wrote: post #105

"Computer languages and “real” languages are actually very similar." I really couldn't disagree with that more. Sure, some languages' syntax borrow English words (Python, Pascal, VB, etc), but that's such a minor similarity. Those words are completely arbitrary and the syntax could have been in Klingon for all the difference it would make to the compiler. Computer languages are a maths language; albeit a very very du…

Natural-language likeness, with all its weirdness and power, was an explicit design goal of Larry Wall's perl, a language which was instrumental in creating the WWW as we know it.

Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

#182

Post by rmc »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #154
rmc wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain this in concrete terms? This meme is repeated often, but few people actually explain what it means. Basically males often do not have to put with things that women often do. The concrete example is in this article. If you're a male contracter and start in a new IT place, and the other co-workers know nothing else about you beside (a) you're working here and (b) you are male, then they are much less li…

This is not remotely close to what "easy mode" and "hard mode" mean in video games. I'm now convinced this meme should die since it obscures more than it helps. Hard mode is not "elevated chance of Balrog attacks, reduced chance of Death Knight attacks". And as you correctly note, the statistical reference class of men have it easier (in some regards), and harder in other regards. For example: "If a straight woman wi…

This is not remotely close to what "easy mode" and "hard mode" mean in video games. … Hard mode is not "elevated chance of Balrog attacks, reduced chance of Death Knight attacks".

Yes it is. Some video games have "the enemies are easier on you" and "bad things less likely to happen" as factors that are controlled by easy mode/hard mode. Anyway, it's just an analogy.

And as you correctly note, the statistical reference class of men have it easier (in some regards), and harder in other regards.

The important question is to tot these all up. After all, it's no good if someone sat down 100 years ago and said: "OK men get all the high paying jobs, ability to vote, serve on juries, be a politician, and the women get less work when dating. Fair?".

I question some of your "advantages women have". Many men actually don't want to be hit on all the time. There are cases of men literally murdering, or reacting violently to, a gay man who's come on to them. Some straight men feel uncomfortable in gay bars. I don't think it's an actual advantage. How much of the "victim of homocide from business partner" is due to women not running businesses as much as men? Perhaps, rather than a advantage, it's a disadvantage.

Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

#183

Post by lurker14 »

archangel_one wrote: post #97
sebcat wrote: post #89

"Guys are fascinated and scared by girls who roll up their sleeves and take on a job that society labels as “men’s work”" Actually, I'm fascinated and scared by all IT people who roll up their sleeves and do manual labour.

An in return, I'm always slightly shocked by this kind of attitude. Just because I write code for a living doesn't mean that I had to forget how to do everything remotely practical first. If I'm confronted by a job that requires manual labour, I don't just stand there saying "oh I'm an IT person, I can't possibly do this".

It's the reverse. I can't carry a bottle of chemicals without spilling it on myself, or take apart an machine without dropping a few pieces in the sewer, so I stick to the virtual world where my poor hand-eye coordination won't get me killed.

Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

#185

Post by d0mine »

sirmarksalot wrote: post #68
d0mine wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is funny that it is ok to exploit nerd stereotypes as demonstrated in the article (nobody cares about yet another nerd in a basement picture). Do you think that the author of the article sees all programmers through the lenses of the stereotype? The picture that you've linked is in bad taste but it won't change the popularity of the stereotype behind it in any way. Do you think that the author of the presentation…

Do we really need to coin the phrase "hacker privilege?" Look, I know it sucked in school, being ostracized for having technical interests, but now you're grown-up and loaded. As part of a larger social agenda, I can see some harm in perpetuating these geek stereotypes, but on a personal level, you are not being exploited, so quit whining.

If it is not clear: "nobody cares about yet another.." here means "nobody (among people that stereotype might be applied to) cares (finds it offensive) about yet another..". That is the meaning is the opposite to your interpretation. I agree the initial comment might have sounded ambiguously.

Your comment could be less patronizing.

Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

#186

Post by sopooneo »

guylhem wrote: post #160
rmc wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Men in that age range have low social status (theirs starts out very low, but increases into the 40s and 50s) while women at that age have high social status (and it declines with age). If I'm parsing this right, you're saying women's social status is mostly based on looks (you say it's better around then) and less so on (cay) career, whereas men's social status is less based on looks, and more on career. You're prob…

If you fight this, will you : a) change the system and improve your success ? b) fail and lower your success ?

or c) change the system and lower your personal success but it's worth it because in aggregate you've helped the world more than you've hurt yourself.

Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

#187

Post by dgabriel »

michaelochurch wrote: post #113

I'll make a controversial observation, but it's worthy of discussion. If you're a woman of average or better looks, you have one under-spoken superpower. Namely, how you interact with other men will have a huge effect on their social status. I'm not talking about overt flirtation (don't do it) or office relationships (avoid, avoid, avoid). I'm talking about more subtle stuff, like who a woman smiles at, who she initi…

It's more likely that a 45 year old exec would be less interested in a 23 year old woman visiting him regularly in his office, in case it appears to be inappropriate. One of the difficulties for young women in IT/Dev is finding a mentor, and having important close relationships with more experienced folks.

Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

#188

Post by dgabriel »

michaelochurch wrote: post #113

I'll make a controversial observation, but it's worthy of discussion. If you're a woman of average or better looks, you have one under-spoken superpower. Namely, how you interact with other men will have a huge effect on their social status. I'm not talking about overt flirtation (don't do it) or office relationships (avoid, avoid, avoid). I'm talking about more subtle stuff, like who a woman smiles at, who she initi…

It's more likely that a 45 year old exec would be less interested in a 23 year old woman visiting him regularly in his office, in case it appears to be inappropriate. One of the difficulties for young women in IT/Dev is finding a mentor, and having important close relationships with more experienced folks.

Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

#189

Post by illuminate »

jrogers65 wrote: post #147
rmc wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a difference between "everybody should walk on eggshells" and "there should be standards". It's not black or white, "eggshells" or "f * you I can say what I want", there is (millions of) middle ground(s). HN has rules and guidelines about how to reply to people ( http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html ). Does that mean "everyone has to walk on eggshells around here"? No, there are rules, but it's not mad…

Actually, yes, people do have to walk on eggshells around here. I am walking on eggshells right now for I can not express myself freely in a forum like this without suffering from social manipulation (downvoting, hellbanning). And this is while adhering to practices such as "no personal insults". In a place like this, you get banned for disagreeing, let alone speaking in an "unapproved" way. This place is hardly an e…

"I am walking on eggshells right now for I can not express myself freely in a forum like this without suffering from social manipulation (downvoting, hellbanning)"

That's certainly a good sign that social sanctions for sexism, racism, etc work. People ~should~ think before they speak, much more than they do in most sites and blogs.

Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech

#190

Post by lurker14 »

dschiptsov wrote: post #157
sjm wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Carsten Dominik wrote org-mode. Looks like she maintained Remember-mode and Planner-mode at one point though.

My fault - I remember that she wrote a popular Emacs package, but forgot the name.

Maintained, not wrote. John Wiegley wrote both.

http://www.emacswiki.org/PlannerMode

It is cool that Sacha maintained it, volunteering is awesome.

I am pointing this correction out because Sacha's primary career is as a self-promotion specialist (http://sachachua.com/blog/), so I have to be skeptical of how her name gets attached to technical work, more so than someone who doesn't pursue celebrity for profit.

People shouldn't think that it's so easy to be famous and a technical contributor. The larger contributors (like John Wiegley in this case) tend to be less famous.

Example: Sure, Linus Torvalds is a celebrity and massive contrbutor, but there are dozens (hundreds?) of other massive Linux kernel contributors who are less famous than, say, Jeff Atwood.

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