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Why you should take your 20's seriously

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Re: Why you should take your 20's seriously

#131

Post by will_work4tears »

genwin wrote: post #106
will_work4tears wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, this is absolutely true in my case (similar though slightly reversed from what you describe). I did the military thing and later college, but switched directions a couple years in college to pick up programming. Even if I reach master skill levels, I'm afraid that my career is stunted because of a short military stint and several years in warehouse/factory jobs before heading off to college. People see that I'm…

You might be looking in the wrong town. Consider moving to a town with a greater demand/supply factor. 3 years experience, if you can show your work (e.g. a website) should be plenty in many places.

Yeah, moving out of state right now is not really an option. We are 2 years into our mortgage and have one of those "you gotta live there 5 years or pay penalties" situations, have a new son (six months old now, so complications with that) and parents getting ready to move 2,200 miles here to help watch and experience their first grandchild.

Granted, all "excuses" but while I have meager pay and bad benefits, my wife makes enough that we don't have any financial problems (just ego ones on my part, lol - she makes 2x my income).

Anyway, we live in the Seattle Metro area, and I'm willing to commute some distance so my opportunities aren't severely limited (I think).

Re: Why you should take your 20's seriously

#132

Post by mediocregopher »

scott_s wrote: post #92
mediocregopher wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where I am (not SF) there's definitely a large showing of programmer/climbers at the local gym. I think a large part of it does have to with the problem solving aspect (hell, we call them problems even), but for me it has more to do with it fitting in with my life a lot more cleanly then any other sport does. I don't have to change into a uniform or put on a whole mess of gear or anything of that sort (when I'm going…

There's more to lifting than counting while sitting down! Strength training that has a focus on powerlifting and Olympic lifting are very different than the bodybuilding focus that tends to pervade most gyms. CrossFit is something to check out if you want more fun strength training.

I apologize, I was being dismissive. I wasn't trying to say that weightlifting/bodybuilding/etc lacked meaning or were inferior, just that the motivations are different, and for me personally the intrinsic motivation of them (this muscle needs to be worked out, then this one, etc...) doesn't work as well for me as the extrinsic motivation (I'm going to finish this problem today) of climbing.

Re: Why you should take your 20's seriously

#134

Post by D_Alex »

neverm0re wrote: post #127
kahawe wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I more or less just came into my 30s and I spent my 20s pretty much exclusively on computers, studying and working and playing. Computer were pretty much 95% of my life. Last time I changed job, I more than doubled my after-tax salary and I have not once had to go through the process of really applying; whenever I showed up to HR things were pretty much decided already in advance, they just had to keep up appearances…

Speaking from the other side here, I started programming at eight and abandoned that in my late teens for partying, sex and adventure through my twenties. Despite landing a scholarship at a respectable school, I walked out the door two months later to go chase a girl. It's only been now in my thirties that I've taken programming and such seriously, because it's suddenly far more fun to me than social games. There's t…

>There's this vague sense of regret much like you're describing, except inverted...

Let me tell you a little joke, it is a running joke in our family. A young man goes to his father for advice: "Should I get married to my girlfriend Jenny or stay single?" Father replies "Son...My dear, dear son... whatever you do, you'll end up regretting it."

But when we are not joking, the advice we give each other is usually "well... whatever you do, things should turn out okay". And that is in fact how it has been.

So, IMHO:

>Really, people should stop worrying about any of this shit

is exactly right.

Re: Why you should take your 20's seriously

#135

Post by gyim »

cletus wrote: post #19

This is a delicate subject because one can view it as a call for those in their 20s to make the most of that time, which is a fine message, to something tantamount to ageism. While it's true that those in their 30s or older can be closed to new idea, that's not because they're "old", it's because they're people and some people are closed-minded. I find a lot of these complaints are more about the cultural and lifesty…

> I don't have that same sense of enthusiasm because for me everything isn't new.

I agree. I think one of the reasons why people in 30s seem to be more "close-minded" to new ideas is because they already have a decade of experience of the (then) fresh new stuff. This is especially true for the IT world.

Let's face it, we are reinventing the wheel in every 5 years. Just look at how frameworks and programming languages go in and out of fashion. You may say "oh man, not again!" when an enthusiastic young programmer tells you how great node.js is - which may be true, but in your open-minded 20s you already learnt Erlang, Twisted, EventMachine and Java NIO for the very same thing.

I'm not yet 30, but I already feel that I am becoming more conservative. I have seen a lot of "hot stuff" come and go, so I try to learn from technologies that seem to persist. Look at C, this old monster: it survived its creator, and for a reason. Now look at YUI or ExtJS: they were so "hot" around 2007, and I haven't even heard them mentioning for a long time. When somebody says that framework/language X is so great and "hot", I am a bit more careful now that 5 years ago: will it be around in 2 years? If not, does it worth even bothering?

Is this closed-mindness or wisdom? Very hard to tell. I am trying to be open-minded in a sense that I try to look and evaluate everything new, but I'm sure that I say "no" to much more things than 5 years before. I wonder how I would see myself in the eye of my 5 year-old younger me.

Re: Why you should take your 20's seriously

#137

Post by gaza3g »

kahawe wrote: post #120
flyosity wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a 29-year old male who spent his 20s building a career I love and now has a 6-month old daughter, so this quote: > Don't waste your 20's "building a career". You've got your 30's and 40's and 50's to do that. Don't be in a rush to have kids too soon. Doesn't really make sense to me. If you don't build a career and finances in your 20s, you either can't afford to have a kid in your early 30s or you have one and ca…

I more or less just came into my 30s and I spent my 20s pretty much exclusively on computers, studying and working and playing. Computer were pretty much 95% of my life. Last time I changed job, I more than doubled my after-tax salary and I have not once had to go through the process of really applying; whenever I showed up to HR things were pretty much decided already in advance, they just had to keep up appearances…

Your post somewhat strikes a chord with me in a way.

Where I come from, most guys at around 20(after junior college) would have to serve the army for 2.5 years. I felt that, that part of my life was seriously wasted since many of my friends who didn't have to serve were doing so many different and interesting things with their life. I felt kinda robbed. Robbed of the prime time of my life. After serving time there, I decided to find a job and started working.

I spent most of my waking hours on computers(programming) and not much on developing personal relationships. At that time, I thought that was the right thing to do, going by social norms.

Had a career so to speak and a girlfriend and I was ready to settle down. But things fell apart and in hindsight, I'm glad that it happened. Like you, I feel that I have not grown emotionally and I'm saying this as someone who just reached 30.

I am in love with the idea of just leaving everything now and try to fix whatever damage I have mentally. Take some time off to travel by myself. I have the time and the resources but I just couldn't bring myself to do it(mental block, fear and uncertainty of travelling alone).

If I could do it all over again, I would have moved somewhere else(if it means being apart from family) and try to find out what I really wanted to do in life and basically just having fun while at it and not worry about having a 'proper career'.

Sorry about going off on a tangent, I didn't think it would be this many lines when I first started typing this.

Re: Why you should take your 20's seriously

#139

Post by donaldc »

genwin wrote: post #97
enraged_camel wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty much. People need to start thinking about their career the moment they get their first job. This means planning out what kinds of skills they need to pick up to advance, opening a retirement account and putting as much money they can into it (compound interest), and never take anything for granted. Those who don't do these things in their 20s are basically going to be 10 years behind everyone who did.

Compound interest at 1% risks losing principal, and inflation is probably > 1% now anyway, so that you lose money on savings. Money spent (rather than invested) in one's 20s offers greater opportunity for enjoyment than when in your 60s, when your choices are more limited, if you even reach your 60s. A balanced approach is best.

Money spent (rather than invested) in one's 20s offers greater opportunity for enjoyment than when in your 60s, when your choices are more limited

Would you care to elaborate on this? I don't (yet) have first-hand experience with being in my 60's, but I did watch my parents spend money to their great enjoyment after they retired in their 60's.

Re: Why you should take your 20's seriously

#140

Post by weej »

>I need to develop as many of the skills I need to lead such a company now, because in a few years it may be difficult or almost impossible to grow in the ways necessary to handle the role.

This neurological development is completely misinterpreted. I already posted on this exact topic not that long ago, but I'll reiterate.

The poster is correct in noting neurological development does come with age in your 20s when one's frontal cortex (or lobes) of the brain fully develop.

This has nothing to do with "developing new skills", but rather its your ability to control higher-order functioning. This could range from long term planning, motivation, and inhibition towards behavior.

When you're young you're somewhat crazy and brash. This allows one to take chances, push the envelope, and reach breakthroughs. If anything this counters the poster's logic, and they should be creating a start-up in their teens instead.

With that said it works both ways. The youth lack the ability fully reason, plan, and in SOME cases think logically through a problem (in the sense of understanding the repercussions of their actions).

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