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TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

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Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#21

Post by MostlyStable »

RHSeeger wrote: post #12
j_walter wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So just get rid of TSA and have no security? They find hundreds of guns in carry on baggage every year, but that should be no big deal right? They didn't force this person through the scanner, they could have asked for a supervisor and discussed the situation. Don't trust the people at the bottom of any organization if you have a concern.

You do know there was airport security before the TSA took over, right?

While I agree that TSA should be done away with, I'm afraid that it wouldn't actually change what airport security looks like in most places. At this point, since people have gotten used to it, my guess is that if Airports took over their own security again (or went back to however it worked pre-TSA), they would maintain about the same standards and procedures in an effort to avoid blame in the case that something happened. Regardless of government involvement, it is extremely hard to work back these ratchets on security theater.

Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#22

Post by JoshTriplett »

j_walter wrote: post #10
QuercusMax wrote: post #4

Like other post-9/11 things like DHS and ICE, we need to abolish TSA since it doesn't actually keep anyone safe, and actively harms people.

So just get rid of TSA and have no security? They find hundreds of guns in carry on baggage every year, but that should be no big deal right? They didn't force this person through the scanner, they could have asked for a supervisor and discussed the situation. Don't trust the people at the bottom of any organization if you have a concern.

> So just get rid of TSA and have no security?

Nobody said that. Go back to pre-2001 airport security, together with locked cockpit doors and the widespread understanding that it isn't safe to cooperate with hijackers.

Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#23

Post by Buttons840 »

QuercusMax wrote: post #4

Like other post-9/11 things like DHS and ICE, we need to abolish TSA since it doesn't actually keep anyone safe, and actively harms people.

You say abolish TSA. That's a "how"; let me ask you about outcomes to better understand.

Are you suggesting that the level of security at airports be reduced?

Are you suggesting that people and object that get onto planes be given less scrutiny?

Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#24

Post by MBCook »

j_walter wrote: post #10
QuercusMax wrote: post #4

Like other post-9/11 things like DHS and ICE, we need to abolish TSA since it doesn't actually keep anyone safe, and actively harms people.

So just get rid of TSA and have no security? They find hundreds of guns in carry on baggage every year, but that should be no big deal right? They didn't force this person through the scanner, they could have asked for a supervisor and discussed the situation. Don't trust the people at the bottom of any organization if you have a concern.

Have you noticed that in 25 years they have never managed to catch a single terrorist? Do you think they would’ve been quiet if they did? No way.

Random citizens on planes have. At least once.

We’ve had lots of stories about them missing weapons. Lots of stories about them making up ridiculous rules. Lots of stories about them sexually harassing people. Lots of stories about random agents going mad with power.

They have never accomplished anything that wasn’t accomplished by the much simpler and less invasive security we had before 9/11.

Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#25

Post by JoshTriplett »

MostlyStable wrote: post #21
RHSeeger wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do know there was airport security before the TSA took over, right?

While I agree that TSA should be done away with, I'm afraid that it wouldn't actually change what airport security looks like in most places. At this point, since people have gotten used to it, my guess is that if Airports took over their own security again (or went back to however it worked pre-TSA), they would maintain about the same standards and procedures in an effort to avoid blame in the case that something ha…

On the contrary, I think airports would desperately like to do better. Airports are hated; improving the experience of airport security is extremely important to them.

Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#26

Post by SunshineTheCat »

MBCook wrote: post #13

I’ve been in a film photography sub on Reddit lately and the TSA comes up frequently. They can’t even follow their own rules on film, telling people it has to be scanned (it doesn’t), scanning is safe up 3800 ISO (that’s not a speed), etc. I’m not surprised they can’t get something important right. What if someone had to fly for necessary medical treatment? What if the device had been something even more important, l…

Yea I once had a TSA individual take my 85mm f1.2 RF series Canon lens out of its case and hold it up to the light to "inspect it."

I said, "can you please be careful with that? It's a $3,000 lens..."

The person cut me off and flatly stated: "Excuse me sir, I know what I'm doing..."

The great thing is that if the person had dropped it, they would've faced zero consequences and I would be out a lens which was central to my need to travel.

Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#27

Post by asdff »

MostlyStable wrote: post #21
RHSeeger wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do know there was airport security before the TSA took over, right?

While I agree that TSA should be done away with, I'm afraid that it wouldn't actually change what airport security looks like in most places. At this point, since people have gotten used to it, my guess is that if Airports took over their own security again (or went back to however it worked pre-TSA), they would maintain about the same standards and procedures in an effort to avoid blame in the case that something ha…

Yeah private security at some stuff pretty much already looks like TSA just with a cheaper scanner.

Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#28

Post by 0xTJ »

Not shocking they seem to have pretty low professional standards. I recently had a friend travelling from the US back to Canada get suddenly thoroughly frisked without warning after the scanners showed some object near her thighs. She didn't have anything but clothes on her body on below the waist. The TSA agent spent time groping around, convinced there was something, then after there couldn't possibly have been an object under her clothes, accepted that (paraphrasing) "there must have been an issue with the scanner".

She called her partner (who I was with at the time) afterwards, upset and shaken by the experience. @TSA in one of the NYC airports: If you're not going to get consent to grope girls, at least let them know that you're about to do it.

Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#29

Post by kube-system »

ceejayoz wrote: post #18
j_walter wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So just get rid of TSA and have no security? They find hundreds of guns in carry on baggage every year, but that should be no big deal right? They didn't force this person through the scanner, they could have asked for a supervisor and discussed the situation. Don't trust the people at the bottom of any organization if you have a concern.

> They find hundreds of guns in carry on baggage every year… They don't exactly have a great track record in that regard. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/investigation-breaches-... "In all, so-called "Red Teams" of Homeland Security agents posing as passengers were able get weapons past TSA agents in 67 out of 70 tests — a 95 percent failure rate, according to agency officials." (Don't worry, though. They fixed…

They're not mutually exclusive things. Red-teamers often have quite a bit of expertise and are smarter than your average threat. And the point of these exercises is precisely to continually improve in response to the findings. But alas, most of the people who bring guns on to planes aren't threats anyway (at least not in the typical sense), they're idiots who forgot their CCW in their bag.

Re: TSA leaves passenger needing surgery after illegally forcing her through scanner

#30

Post by chaps »

I'm one of those weirdos who opts out of the scanners because I'd rather avoid having people casually look inside of my body.

Last time I flew out of Laguardia I opted out and while I was being patted down another TSA agent about twenty feet away kept making kissy faces at me. Very much felt like intimidation.

What a time..

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