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Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

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Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#701

Post by troad »

Alex_L_Wood wrote: post #559

It’s so funny reading most comments here, knowing that they’d be celebrating and saying this is good if it was Netanyahu. But when it’s a maniacal islamist declaring his goal to be the destruction of US and Israel, it’s suddenly very nuanced.

It's funny how being partisan makes one "know" all these unknowable, evidence-free hypotheticals about the other side.

Must be nice, to replace the difficult art of getting things done in politics with merely spectating at a soccer match. Team Green or Team Blue? Get your bumper stickers and profile emojis.

Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#702

Post by pydry »

beloch wrote: post #413
baxtr wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am old enough. Iraq is not perfect today but so much better than it was. Go talk to Iraqis and see for yourself. It costs us some time, money and lives to get to this point. But Saddam (a tyrant who killed his own kind in masses with gas and started wars with neighbors) staying in power would have been way worse for the wider region.

Iraq is a fantastic lesson to heed today. In the first gulf war, Bush Sr. refused to occupy the country. He viewed it as too difficult and too expensive. In the second gulf war, Bush Jr. declared victory from the deck of an aircraft carrier, occupied the country, hunted and executed its leader, and then opened the U.S. treasury to deal with the aftermath. Thousands of Americans died. Hundreds of thousands of Iraqi's…

>There isn't even a falsified pretext like WMD's to quiet the howling in the UN.

30,000 dead protestors.

The source for both was "the state department bribed a guy in the Iraqi/Iranian government and you'll NEVER guess what he told us...."

Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#703

Post by Ylpertnodi »

Hnrobert42 wrote: post #574
Alifatisk wrote: post #523

What is happening to this world. There is so many intense events happening in a such short time. I feel like we are truly living in weird times. Trumpet is out here deciding the fate of countries future for his own good. Now, it so happens to be something that benefited the Iranians. But I do not think he did it for the people directly, rather a side effect. I feel like I've lost the touch of which direction our futu…

I've begun to think of Trump as a forest fire. The consequences may be horrible, at least for the status quo, but it does provide an opportunity for new beginnings. At least, that is the only way I maintain hope.

A 'new beginning' eould be vance in charge?

Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#704

Post by CoastalCoder »

dotancohen wrote: post #698
ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #695

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those values seem to be exactly the ones being discarded by the Christo-fascists of the USA. My point is that the so-called Christian values are nothing to do with the reported teachings of Jesus and instead are used to justify the exact opposite.

I did not realize that the point of discussion had changed to specifically Christo-fascists of the USA. My point still stands in regard to the vast majority of Christians you will meet. One thing that I can not stand about some modern fanatics is the representation of 1% of a population as if they represent the whole. Don't bring up Christo-fascists of the USA as representative of Christian values. That's highjacking…

This is an awesome discussion.

It's showing that we need to make some finer distinctions to meaningfully engage with each other on the topic.

It beats the heck out of each side assuming bad-faith.

Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#705

Post by dj_rock »

dotancohen wrote: post #620
breppp wrote: post #549

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jordan political system is much older than Iran, as well as the Saudis and others. Iran theocracy is a new phenomena in the Middle East, ushering the implementation era of political Islam, later continued by ISIS, Hamas and the milder Qatar and current Turkey

[flagged]

The Catholic Church exerted strong influence in Quebec until the 1950s. Of course since then Quebec has become the most secular region in North America.

Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#706

Post by acdha »

sethev wrote: post #664
throwaway173738 wrote: post #655

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People lose cognition as they age.

And gain experience

That’s true, but it’s not always good—Americans have stark examples of the risks of octogenarian leaders whose experience leads them astray by discounting how much the world has changed since they were young.

I think of mental faculties and experience as two separate overlapping curves where there’s a sweet spot in the middle where both are high but either one being low can become a big problem.

They also just don’t have the same energy they used to so even if they have a good idea they’ll be less effective at motivating people to embrace it, and the younger people behind them are going to be acting with more thought to succession politics.

Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#707

Post by morkalork »

jonathanstrange wrote: post #482
Alifatisk wrote: post #479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of all options, why would Denmarks prime minister be next?

Refusal to hand over Greenland. (I'm not saying it's plausible, just want to explain the rationale.)

It does feel like we're on a slippery slope though. Normalizing and supporting the violation of international norms because 'they were bad guys and deserved it' is like turning a blind eye to corruption when its people you agree with. It doesn't lead anywhere good in the end.

Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#708

Post by urikaduri »

throw0101c wrote: post #682
HDThoreaun wrote: post #665

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US didn’t mass kill Jan 6ers.

> The US didn’t mass kill Jan 6ers. Were the Jan6ers good guys or bad guys? Did they deserve to get punished? (Trump didn't/doesn't think so, which is why he pardoned them; Pence may have a different opinion.) The fact that different countries have different punishments for the same crime is a cultural artefact. The fact that you find it unacceptable is personal opinion. In Singapore drug use (not even distribution)…

I didn't know there were still fans around for this version of moral relativisim.

The IRGC mass killing of protesters was evil. Objectively so. Anyone thinking otherwise is part of the problem.

Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#709

Post by maybelsyrup »

dotancohen wrote: post #692
simmerup wrote: post #683

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But dude was 86, how many people in nursing homes would you trust to run a country?

Probably one in a thousand. But as one whom the Ayatollah has sworn to eliminate, I can still state that man was sharp and brilliant and extremely well spoken. His worldview was internally consistent. He had vision and experience and knew how to motivate people. He was a one in ten million leader. I give him that praise and more, even recognising that his stated mission was to exterminate myself and my children.

> But as one whom the Ayatollah has sworn to eliminate

What does this mean — did you stick him with the bill at all restaurant or something?

Re: Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is killed in Israeli strike, ending 36-year rule

#710

Post by leonvoss »

sethev wrote: post #664
throwaway173738 wrote: post #655

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People lose cognition as they age.

And gain experience

And as we can see with Biden and Trump, 86 is past the the optimal compromise between experience and cognition.
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