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OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

wired.com

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Re: OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

#11
EDIT: I am wrong, see children

> The employee, she said, “used confidential OpenAI information in connection with external prediction markets (e.g. Polymarket).”

Note that “insider trading” is not illegal on prediction markets. The particular issue here is that the employee “disclosed” confidential information on a public forum by influencing the prices assigned to certain outcomes by prediction markets.

Re: OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

#12
post #9
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really understand. You can create wallets at will. What would be the value of one that someone else happened to create?

If it has a small transaction history it obscure the owners intentions. An address created right before a wager is obviously for one purpose.

Right but if you have the forethought to go buy such a wallet, you could just make one yourself in advance and create a transaction history.

Although I would argue that even this doesn't have much value. It's not a big problem that people know "there exists an insider at OpenAI". There are plenty of employees there that shield you from being discovered.

In fact it would be so difficult to find this person among them, assuming the most basic opsec, that I'm highly skeptical they actually fired anyone. I would sooner assume this is just an announcement designed to discourage the behavior, since no specifics are provided.

Re: OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

#13

Interestingly Kalshi has ‘banned’ insider trading, whilst polymarkets often tweets that some of their users must have inside information https://news.kalshi.com/p/kalshi-trading-violation-enforceme... https://x.com/polymarketmoney/status/2001056273500954784?s=4...

Manifold actually explicitly encourages insider trading, arguing that it leads to more accurate pricing. This was possibly defensible back when it was a cute funtime project run by a Bay Area polycule, but it’s probably going to get them in deep shit sooner or later, even though they don’t even use real-money betting.

Re: OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

#14
post #3

A fun aside: this person obviously created a bunch of new Bitcoin accounts to hide their activity. It makes you think that if you were able to surreptitiously add malicious side channel software into a popular npm package that you wouldn't just need to hunt for crypto wallets with balances. You could also probably find a market for crypto wallets with small balances or zero balances. The history and date of creation…

> created a bunch of new Bitcoin accounts to hide their activity

tell me you don’t understand crypto without telling me you don’t understand crypto.

Re: OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

#15
post #11

EDIT: I am wrong, see children > The employee, she said, “used confidential OpenAI information in connection with external prediction markets (e.g. Polymarket).” Note that “insider trading” is not illegal on prediction markets. The particular issue here is that the employee “disclosed” confidential information on a public forum by influencing the prices assigned to certain outcomes by prediction markets.

I don't think this is true, though enforcement is another thing and the standard is different than in securities markets. Prediction markets are regulated by the CFTC and the insider trading standard is “misappropriation of confidential information in breach of a pre-existing duty of trust and confidence to the source of the information” (vs any “material non-public information” for securities) https://www.cftc.gov/PressRoom/SpeechesTestimony/phamstateme...

Re: OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

#16

Interestingly Kalshi has ‘banned’ insider trading, whilst polymarkets often tweets that some of their users must have inside information https://news.kalshi.com/p/kalshi-trading-violation-enforceme... https://x.com/polymarketmoney/status/2001056273500954784?s=4...

Manifold actually explicitly encourages insider trading, arguing that it leads to more accurate pricing. This was possibly defensible back when it was a cute funtime project run by a Bay Area polycule, but it’s probably going to get them in deep shit sooner or later, even though they don’t even use real-money betting.

Though Manifold only uses their non-withdrawable play currency Mana.

Re: OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

#17
post #11

EDIT: I am wrong, see children > The employee, she said, “used confidential OpenAI information in connection with external prediction markets (e.g. Polymarket).” Note that “insider trading” is not illegal on prediction markets. The particular issue here is that the employee “disclosed” confidential information on a public forum by influencing the prices assigned to certain outcomes by prediction markets.

It is most definitely against the rules of the sites and illegal, especially on kalshi

Re: OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

#18
post #12
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it has a small transaction history it obscure the owners intentions. An address created right before a wager is obviously for one purpose.

Right but if you have the forethought to go buy such a wallet, you could just make one yourself in advance and create a transaction history. Although I would argue that even this doesn't have much value. It's not a big problem that people know "there exists an insider at OpenAI". There are plenty of employees there that shield you from being discovered. In fact it would be so difficult to find this person among them,…

You are giving a lot of credit to this criminal. I really doubt they thought about this long in advance of the crime. Are you suggesting they got hired at openai so they could make calculated wagers at Kalshi? This was more likely a crime made impulsively.

Re: OpenAI fires an employee for prediction market insider trading

#19
77 suspicious positions across 60 wallets, 13 brand-new accounts appearing 40 hours before the browser launch. First confirmed case of a major tech company firing over prediction market trades.

I wrote about why prediction markets have a structural insider trading problem that nobody's solved yet: https://philippdubach.com/posts/the-absolute-insider-mess-of...

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