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Keep Your Identity Small

paulgraham.com

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Re: Keep Your Identity Small

#51

Post by gustaf »

patio11 wrote: post #18

I have a friend who, when asked his nationality, will always respond "citizen of the world". He thinks that the answer has much to recommend it and that it is not an identity. He is right in the first respect and very wrong in the other. Ditto with "Having considered the alternatives rationally, I reject the notion of having an identity vis a vis [religion, politics, etc]".

I think the problem your friend is doing it that he/she thinks people will draw conclusions from his identity.

I'm Swedish. But it doesn't mean that I'll defend Sweden in a war against Norway. I have very little more in common with the Swedes who lives on the border to Norway then the Norwegians who live on the border to Sweden. However, I'm Swedish - I grew up there and I have my cultural heritage from there. That's not wrong - it's just fact

Re: Keep Your Identity Small

#52

Post by cglee »

This is one of my favorite PG essays because it's applicable to anyone. I think the opposite is also valid though - an identity that encompasses all. If you think about it, it gives you the same power of objectivity as not letting anything in.

Re: Keep Your Identity Small

#53

Post by psyklic »

This confluence of religion and politics was especially prominent in the recent gay marriage debate.

Really, the entire issue revolves around the word "marriage" having a dual meaning in a religious sense and a (government) civil contract sense. When the government "redefines" civil marriage (e.g. with the inclusion of interracial couples), religious organizations can still retain their own definitions of marriage.

If the government had originally had all couples register as "civil unions" and optionally marry in churches, then surprisingly this debate may never have occurred -- it is purely semantical.

Re: Keep Your Identity Small

#54

Post by mrtron »

"I finally realized today why politics and religion yield such uniquely useless discussions."

In the context of HN or other topic specific forums your points are valid. Check your guns at the door.

Re: Keep Your Identity Small

#56

Post by [deleted] »

RK wrote: post #11

A technical note about his note [1]. pg says, When that happens, it tends to happen fast, like a core going critical , but he probably means "like a core going super critical", which is when a chain reaction goes on at an increasing rate (i.e. what you need for a nuclear explosion). Critical is an equilibrium (i.e the self-sustaining condition, as used for power generation). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_mass

[deleted]

Re: Keep Your Identity Small

#57

Post by pg »

RK wrote: post #11

A technical note about his note [1]. pg says, When that happens, it tends to happen fast, like a core going critical , but he probably means "like a core going super critical", which is when a chain reaction goes on at an increasing rate (i.e. what you need for a nuclear explosion). Critical is an equilibrium (i.e the self-sustaining condition, as used for power generation). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_mass

Hmm. I could change it. But are you sure it wouldn't be hypercorrect to phrase it that way? Isn't going critical a kind of shorthand for going supercritical, because in practice any situation that produces the first is going to produce the second?

Edit: Actually I think criticality is the right metaphor. It's a change in state from what preceded it. That's the important part, not the resulting explosion. (Arguably there are in fact analogs to control rods in online discussions-- nesting depth, the fact that people get tired after a while, etc.)

Re: Keep Your Identity Small

#58

Post by kaens »

bokonist wrote: post #39
gabrielroth wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would that happen? Just because the two fields have certain things in common doesn't mean they're indistinguishable.

Actually, the two are much closer than you think. All major religions achieved their growth and status by becoming the ideological arm of state power. Both politics and religion are fundamentally about how people think about the rulers.

Organized religion, certainly. However, there is a lot of conflation of Religion and religion (or faith).

I don't disagree with your point, it just deals with very semantically messy stuff.

Re: Keep Your Identity Small

#60

Post by pg »

immad wrote: post #8

I think I concur that in educated discussions Identity does not help, but I have been thinking through the importance of identity for a while. I think in many situations identity gives you strength. I have an identity within Y Combinator, with my family, with people that went to my University, in the countries I have lived in etc. These fragments of my identity all give me strength, it means I would help people out t…

You're right. That's why I was careful to qualify it with "all other things being equal."

In general identity gives you strength while making you stupid. This can sometimes be a good trade, especially in stressful situations. E.g. I think this is one reason people in the US are so much more religious than they were when I was a kid. People who 30 years ago might have been skeptical of preachers are now thinking that religion may at least save their kids from meth.

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