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Scott Forstall leaves Apple

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Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#151

Post by DanBC »

pooriaazimi wrote: post #28
feverishaaron wrote: post #11

Interesting that Jony will be overseeing UI. I expect a more minimalistic polish to upcoming interfaces. In other words, this is the beginning of the end for the skeuomorphism trend at Apple.

No. It's not UI, it's HI (Human Interface) now! It's best we all get used to it. It'll be repeated again and again from now on :) Edit: This is what I mean: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Interface > Wikipedia does not have an article with this exact name. Please search for _Human Interface_ in Wikipedia to check for alternative titles or spellings. It's still a non-word, but will be an (oft-used) word soon enoug…

Human Interface (as in Human Interface Device) was even used by MS during drafting of the USB standard. Admittedly that's hardware, not software, but Human Interface isn't a new thing.

Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#152

Post by snowwrestler »

matheusalmeida wrote: post #50

Given that 50% of the posts talk about skeuomorphism and honestly I didn't know what it was, here's the definition from Wikipedia: "A skeuomorph, or skeuomorphism is when a product imitates design elements functionally necessary in the original product design, but that becomes ornamental in the new product design" .

It's a new word for an old concept: a decorative anachronism. Obvious examples from outside the world of computing include stone pillars in front of important buildings, and rivets on jeans.

It's abused here on HN as short-hand for app decorations that people don't like, like the infamous leather treatment on the calendar.

But there are plenty of "skeuomorphic" aspects to iOS that I never see anyone complain about (and sometimes compliment), like inertial scrolling or sliding on/off switches.

Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#153

Post by cpeterso »

brudgers wrote: post #92
mratzloff wrote: post #22

He oversaw Siri and Maps, two products which over-promised and under-delivered, and six months ago he cashed out 95% of his Apple stock. I think it was evident he lost the power struggle and it killed his enthusiasm. His heart just wasn't in it anymore.

75,000 options vesting in 2013 and 100,000 vesting in 2014 probably explain the year as adviser - i.e. fiscal year 2013 ends October 1, 2013 so one year from today is probably adequate for those options to vest and may have been an equitable way to resolve severance negotiations.

Why even have a vesting period if the company is going to give them to executives anyway? If Tim wants Scott out, then why pamper him with free money? It's not benefiting shareholders.

Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#154

Post by eridius »

feverishaaron wrote: post #89
dclusin wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're the second person that mentioned skeuomorphism. Could you please explain what it is and why it's a big todo? Most of my cursory google searches don't provide any particularly insightful definition of what it is. The blogs/rants usually just dive into why it's good or bad.

Skeuomorphism has been interpreted two ways - as decorative elements (leather stitching), and in functionality that attempts to emulate a real world object (page flipping in an e-book). The former is just a matter of aesthetic preference. Where skeuomorphism gets dangerous is in the latter case. A perfect example is the horrible address book in OS X. It looks like a book, and therefore the user expects it to function…

You give "page flipping in an e-book" as an example of dangerous skeuomorphism, but then cite Address Book as why it's bad. I'm a bit confused. I get why you don't like Address Book, but do you really think page flipping in an e-reader is bad too? If so, why do you think that?

Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#155

Post by Steko »

danilocampos wrote: post #53

Interesting that Eddie Cue remains the company fixer, taking on the quirky Siri and the flakey Maps app just as he was once given a completely fucked up MobileMe. This is good news. Even better news is Browett's ouster. The business with his cutting operational corners in retail was a very, very bad omen. If they'd left him in, he might have poisoned a very important well for the company. Hopefully his replacement is…

As much as Apple's software and hardware are talked about, Eddie Cue is also the guy largely responsible for negotiating Apple's superior media offerings which is arguably Apple's biggest lead on their competitors internationally.

Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#156

Post by snowwrestler »

feverishaaron wrote: post #89
dclusin wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're the second person that mentioned skeuomorphism. Could you please explain what it is and why it's a big todo? Most of my cursory google searches don't provide any particularly insightful definition of what it is. The blogs/rants usually just dive into why it's good or bad.

Skeuomorphism has been interpreted two ways - as decorative elements (leather stitching), and in functionality that attempts to emulate a real world object (page flipping in an e-book). The former is just a matter of aesthetic preference. Where skeuomorphism gets dangerous is in the latter case. A perfect example is the horrible address book in OS X. It looks like a book, and therefore the user expects it to function…

By your latter definition, inertial scrolling with snap-back is skeuomorphic, and that is universally praised (and copied).

Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#157

Post by arrrg »

brudgers wrote: post #80
ececconi wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't wait to see how much cleaner future versions of iOS will be.

If they aren't staying skeuomorphic, then Metro might give you a preview.

I don’t think Apple will go that far. I don’t even think they will overtake stock Android when it comes to ditching skeumorphism and removing affordances.

I also don’t think there will be radical changes. Remember how OS X looked before Corinthian leather arrived? That’s what I see more off in the future. Probably with an updated look (like the new iTunes?), but not much more.

If you want to know how that looks on iOS I would maybe look at something like the editing interface of iMovie, Safari, or Mail.

That would be my guess.

Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#158

Post by bronxbomber92 »

revelation wrote: post #133

I'm not an Apple insider. Pushing Google Maps away seems to me like a political decision reserved for someone like Cook, not Forstall. If Cook shoved Google out and tasked Forstall with the impossible task of developing a better maps offering in what amounts to a year, this would be a sign that upper management jumped the shark, not Forstall himself.

Maps was started while Jobs was around, so at the very least you can't accuse Cook of that.

Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#159

Post by crag »

wisty wrote: post #110
mukaiji wrote: post #33

Just to be clear, he's not "leaving." He got fired. He got fired because after the map fiasco became apparent, he refused to send out an apology or sign his name to the one Tim Cook sent. (internal knowledge)

(No internal knowledge) I'm surprised he got fired over maps. Mapping is hard - comparable to writing a search engine. Apple did as well as can be expected for a first attempt. They had some kind of problem with Google Maps, and wanted to build their own capability, which was never going to be easy. He might have been fired if he cheated, by creating a well curated Valley dataset to prove to the other execs what a gr…

I learned a long time ago honesty and taking ownership is the best policy.

It possible that he though he did no wrong. Or maybe he thought he was above the fray. But if he wanted to save his job, owning the wrong is the best way. People forgive when the apology is genuine.

Re: Scott Forstall leaves Apple

#160

Post by sigzero »

dave1619 wrote: post #88

Here are the major changes announced: 1. Jony Ive's role is expanded from Industrial Design to Industrial Design AND Human Interface. In other words, Ive is the new Design chief for hardware and software. This is huge. 2. Scott Forstall is out (after an interim advising role to Tim Cook). iOS goes to Craig Federighi who already oversees Mac OS. So, now iOS and Mac OS are overseen by the same person. 3. Eddy Cue's rol…

I agree! I only see good in these moves.
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