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Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

bbc.com

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Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#61

Post by dataflow »

gambutin wrote: post #21
weakfish wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Idk, I’ve never seen any left wing folks actively support the Iranian regime. I think the difference is what you noted, the US support for Israel vs. intervention in Iran. I, and many I know, would love to see the Iranian regime fall, just not via US regime change which tends to make things worse.

You mean like the US regime changes in Germany and Japan 1945? Those ones were really bad for the local population!

"Regime change" here refers to coup d'états. Meanwhile those were declared(!) wars. In response to existing wars dragging the US into them. Involving countries that were in very different places both politically and geographically.

A coup is... not even remotely the same thing. How many coups do you know of that helped the local population?

Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#62

Post by tolerance »

The irony of this submission’s proximity to another titled “Attention Media ≠ Social Networks” cannot escape me.

Balance cannot be restored until a whimsy Show HN appears Monday afternoon followed by an LLM EDC by a high profile FOSS developer the following day and then rounded out by a “cozy web elegy” come Hump Day.

Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#63

Post by Rover222 »

conception wrote: post #44
Rover222 wrote: post #15

[flagged]

Generally in global politics if you are just killing your own people everything is cool. People don’t really get into it until you cross borders.

People seemed to care about the Myanmar and Chinese genocides. Muslim victims. Non-muslim oppressors.

But Central Africa, Venezuela, Iran, Cuba, etc? Extreme suffering. But the activists don't activate.

Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#64

Post by Rover222 »

Rover222 wrote: post #36
weakfish wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Idk, I’ve never seen any left wing folks actively support the Iranian regime. I think the difference is what you noted, the US support for Israel vs. intervention in Iran. I, and many I know, would love to see the Iranian regime fall, just not via US regime change which tends to make things worse.

Yeah I see anyone actively supporting the Iranian regime, just that they're apparently not interested in the cause of the people protesting and being massacred. I think it's just an instinct to oppose anything the current administration supports. Same with Cuba and Venezuela. But it consistently aligns them with some of the most suppressive regimes. Venezuelans are glad Maduro is gone. Iranians want the US to do some…

* don't see anyone actively supporting

Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#65

Post by alephnerd »

regularization wrote: post #14
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #7

“To simplify greatly, the strategy of non-violence aims first to cause disruption (non-violently) in order both to draw attention but also in order to bait state overreaction. The state’s overreaction then becomes the ‘spectacular attack’ which broadcasts the movement’s message, while the group’s willingness to endure that overreaction without violence not only avoids alienating supporters, it heightens the contrast…

> non-violence Armed Baloch and Kurdish groups have been boasting of firing on Iranian police. The police are firing back. Hard to call them non-violent when they openly boast about armed attacks. Who knows where they are getting their weapons, with western countries also openly declaring their intent to destabilize Iran.

The Baloch movement is orthogonal to the students movement.

Jaish al-Adl would continue bombing Iranian police stations regardless of who's in power in Tehran as long as India maintains operational control of Chabahar Port, Chabahar-Zahedan Railway, and INSTC.

Similarly, the BLA and BNA would continue bombing Pakistani police stations regardless of who's in power in Islamabad/Pindi as long as China maintains operational control of Gwadar Port, the Western Alignment expressway, and CPEC.

Iran is de facto non-existent in much of Sistan-ve-Balochistan. Heck, Urdu/Hindi fluency remains the norm in much of Iranian Balochistan as a large portion of Iranian Baloch continue to have family ties across the border in Pakistan, work with their brethren in the Gulf as migrant workers, or travel to Karachi, Quetta, or India for medical, religious (most Iranian Baloch are Deobandi), and education services.

Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#66

Post by don_esteban »

myko wrote: post #11
regularization wrote: post #2

[flagged]

Same vibes as folks whining about the US being behind Euromaidan in Ukraine (the US was not). Nope, folks, people really do not like being oppressed or lied to, and will on occasion let you know that in dramatic fashion.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/nov/26/ukraine.usa

Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#67

Post by Wytwwww »

regularization wrote: post #14
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #7

“To simplify greatly, the strategy of non-violence aims first to cause disruption (non-violently) in order both to draw attention but also in order to bait state overreaction. The state’s overreaction then becomes the ‘spectacular attack’ which broadcasts the movement’s message, while the group’s willingness to endure that overreaction without violence not only avoids alienating supporters, it heightens the contrast…

> non-violence Armed Baloch and Kurdish groups have been boasting of firing on Iranian police. The police are firing back. Hard to call them non-violent when they openly boast about armed attacks. Who knows where they are getting their weapons, with western countries also openly declaring their intent to destabilize Iran.

> with western countries also openly declaring their intent to destabilize Iran

As opposed to standing idly by when the regime 'stabilizes' the country by murdering thousands of people? It's well past the stage where non violent protest or resistance stopped being a viable option..

Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#68

Post by Rover222 »

georgeburdell wrote: post #38
Rover222 wrote: post #15

[flagged]

My impression is that protests in the West are largely MAGA aligned and focused more on regime change. Totally different target audience. Observe “MIGA” slogans and Trump’s face in this video from Los Angeles https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=20T6XrrLdiA&pp=ygUYbG9zIGFuZ2V... Edit: Also, the Left seems to more often pick sides when its one ethnic group oppressing another, as identity politics is prominent in their messag…

I think if Biden was taking a lot of the same actions the Trump admin is taking, people would support it a lot more (Venezuela, Cuba, Iran, maybe even Gaza).

Of course then the right would be protesting foreign interventions.

Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#69

Post by ycombinete »

mattmaroon wrote: post #6
lokar wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you arguing the protests did not happen? That they did not happen as reported? That they did happen as reported, but it should not have been reported? What is your point?

Look at their comments. They’re almost certainly a Russian propaganda account, or someone who has been brainwashed by them.

The z in the username feels like a clue.

Re: Iran students stage first large anti-government protests since deadly crackdown

#70

Post by akiselev »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #7

“To simplify greatly, the strategy of non-violence aims first to cause disruption (non-violently) in order both to draw attention but also in order to bait state overreaction. The state’s overreaction then becomes the ‘spectacular attack’ which broadcasts the movement’s message, while the group’s willingness to endure that overreaction without violence not only avoids alienating supporters, it heightens the contrast…

The book Brett uses as his main source, Waging A Good War, is an incredible book that I strongly recommend. It treats the Civil Rights movement as a military campaign and analyzes it from the perspective of a military historian.

Not in the sense that it was viewed as a war by the protestors, but in the sense that the logistics, training, and operations of the Civil Rights movement were a well oiled machine that looked like a well organized, but nonviolent, army (including counterexamples where there was no organization).

One of the most memorable details is how James Lawson trained in nonviolence under Ghandi and came over to train protestors in nonviolent tactics. They gathered in church basements to scream insults and spit on each other to prepare for the restaurant sitins and other ops.

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