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The wonder of modern drywall

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Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#121

Post by glitchc »

willis936 wrote: post #99
jf___ wrote: post #41

A huge share of the gypsum used in drywall is *synthetic gypsum* — a byproduct of flue-gas desulfurization (FGD) at coal-fired power plants. When SO₂ is scrubbed from exhaust using limestone, the reaction produces calcium sulfate dihydrate, chemically identical to mined gypsum. In the US, FGD gypsum has accounted for roughly half of all gypsum consumed by the wallboard industry at its peak. The "cheap, uniform, and f…

This reminds me a bit of Hank Green's recent video on why we don't recycle plastic. The answer is we frack a lot of methane for electricity and ethane is a byporoduct of that. You can flare it off or use it as a negative cost ingredient for polyethane / many other plastics. As long as we're using lots of fossil fuels the byproducts will be cheap. Anyone who has played gregtech or factorio or similar already has an in…

Isn't that common knowledge, that plastics aren't feasible without fossil fuels?

Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#122

Post by glitchc »

pibaker wrote: post #82
BadBadJellyBean wrote: post #67

As a German I always found North American houses and their drywall and wood constructions incredibly odd. It always felt flimsy to me. From my experience we just started using drywall for some interior walls on some newly built homes. But throughout my life I was used to very massive walls. I recently saw some house building videos and it is somehow fascinating how different the building materials and methodologies a…

I suspect the prevalence of "flimsy" wood and drywall constructions to be part of the reason why Americans dislike apartment living. They provide little sound insulation, are prone to water damage, have a shorter lifespan than the average person and once they catch fire they burn the entire thing down. Concrete or brick buildings are much nicer to live in, but expensive, so they are not very common among new construc…

Actually apartment buildings are mostly concrete. Strip away finishings like cabinets, drywall and flooring from a unit, and what's left is a concrete cell. Sometimes separating walls within a unit are wood based but that's rare too.

Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#123

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

amluto wrote: post #100
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can see it on a thermal camera with a high resolution sensor from China (not the ITAR limited US tech).

Got a link? This sounds handy.

Thermal Master P3: 25fps, 256x192, manual focus

Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#124

Post by rkomorn »

glitchc wrote: post #122
pibaker wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect the prevalence of "flimsy" wood and drywall constructions to be part of the reason why Americans dislike apartment living. They provide little sound insulation, are prone to water damage, have a shorter lifespan than the average person and once they catch fire they burn the entire thing down. Concrete or brick buildings are much nicer to live in, but expensive, so they are not very common among new construc…

Actually apartment buildings are mostly concrete. Strip away finishings like cabinets, drywall and flooring from a unit, and what's left is a concrete cell. Sometimes separating walls within a unit are wood based but that's rare too.

I think you and OP just have different definitions for "apartment building".

I've lived in pretty large buildings (eg dozens of units and four floors high) that were largely made of wood in both the northeast of the US and California.

They aren't high-rise buildings but I wouldn't argue they aren't apartment buildings, and they're far from uncommon.

Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#125

Post by staringforward »

glitchc wrote: post #122
pibaker wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect the prevalence of "flimsy" wood and drywall constructions to be part of the reason why Americans dislike apartment living. They provide little sound insulation, are prone to water damage, have a shorter lifespan than the average person and once they catch fire they burn the entire thing down. Concrete or brick buildings are much nicer to live in, but expensive, so they are not very common among new construc…

Actually apartment buildings are mostly concrete. Strip away finishings like cabinets, drywall and flooring from a unit, and what's left is a concrete cell. Sometimes separating walls within a unit are wood based but that's rare too.

[dead]

Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#126

Post by _alternator_ »

glitchc wrote: post #121
willis936 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me a bit of Hank Green's recent video on why we don't recycle plastic. The answer is we frack a lot of methane for electricity and ethane is a byporoduct of that. You can flare it off or use it as a negative cost ingredient for polyethane / many other plastics. As long as we're using lots of fossil fuels the byproducts will be cheap. Anyone who has played gregtech or factorio or similar already has an in…

Isn't that common knowledge, that plastics aren't feasible without fossil fuels?

This is different—the cost of plastic goes up if fossil fuel consumption goes down because currently it uses a waste stream. Not sure if it’s true, but it’s different than my prior intuition about fossil fuel and plastic.

Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#127

Post by kmoser »

MarkMarine wrote: post #56
kmoser wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't call it trivial. First you have to determine where to cut it; if you cut the wrong area you have to cut again. All the steps in repairing it either take time, are messy, or require some skill, and the time adds up (e.g. waiting for the patch to dry before you can sand; waiting for the primer to dry before you can paint; etc.). And then you have to match the surrounding paint, which is all but impossible si…

Ok, I glossed over color matching the wall patch. Fair. But there really aren’t many walls you need to open in a house. There is probably 2-3 wet walls, so unless you need to retrofit some ducting why are you opening a wall? Code says there are no hidden wire junctions, so you’ve just got continuous runs of romex that are secured before they terminate… what do you open a wall for? Most of the drywall repair is just p…

In theory, I'd rather get at something through an access panel than via cutting and patching drywall, but practically speaking, you're right: it's rare to have to open a wall, and an access panel that isn't specifically for something you need to access regularly is just a nice-to-have, and not even necessarily all that useful unless it provides the access you actually need at the time.

Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#128

Post by lmz »

rkomorn wrote: post #124
glitchc wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually apartment buildings are mostly concrete. Strip away finishings like cabinets, drywall and flooring from a unit, and what's left is a concrete cell. Sometimes separating walls within a unit are wood based but that's rare too.

I think you and OP just have different definitions for "apartment building". I've lived in pretty large buildings (eg dozens of units and four floors high) that were largely made of wood in both the northeast of the US and California. They aren't high-rise buildings but I wouldn't argue they aren't apartment buildings, and they're far from uncommon.

AKA the 5-over-1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5-over-1

Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#129

Post by porknubbins »

If I ever get to build a house I’m using that high density drywall they have in hospitals everywhere but the ceiling. It doesn’t cost that much more compared to the labor and it would be enormously satisfying to know your walls can’t be easily dented or damaged.

Re: The wonder of modern drywall

#130

Post by rootusrootus »

ragall wrote: post #106
rootusrootus wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's just what you get used to. Every method has ups and downs. And different regions are going to gravitate to different materials based on availability (for example, my Indian coworkers just cannot fathom why we would ever build houses from trees instead of reinforced concrete; doesn't it rot?!!). I don't think of the walls as especially flimsy, though. Built correctly, they are totally fine. Yes you can pu…

Stick frame buildings are prone to dry rot, very susceptible to molding, and the addition of drywalls* make them objectively inferior for any building that's expected to last more than ~40-50 years. It used to be, 100 years ago, that the big cities like NYC, Chicago, Cincinnati, etc... were so dynamic that entire neighbourhoods were expected to be rebuilt every ~50 years or so. That's no longer the case. Over a lifes…

I may be biased, because I live in a city filled with houses over 100 years old, and we get incessant rain. They seem to hold up fine. Not sure how long they’ll last but there hasn’t been any push to replace them.
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