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Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

nytimes.com

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Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#541

Post by w0de0 »

jacquesm wrote: post #532
lysace wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fox News first reported that the airborne object was intercepted after raising concerns of a potential drone operating near the southern border. Officials later concluded the object was not an unmanned aircraft but a party balloon, a U.S. official told the outlet. https://www.foxnews.com/politics/us-military-shot-down-party... US military shot down party balloon near El Paso after drone suspicion, official says Would…

Just think about the terrorist potential here. Buy a $10 party balloon, let it go near a major airport and they'll panic and shut down the airport. That's a lot of havoc for a couple of bucks.

It's one balloon, Michael. What could it cost, 10 dollars?

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#542

Post by procflora »

It's inter-organizational disfunction. Always more plausible than any conspiracy.

https://apnews.com/article/faa-el-paso-texas-air-space-close...

Pentagon wanted to test the new laser but didn't give FAA enough information to assure safety of the NAS and civilian aviation (when, where, effects, etc.) so they felt forced to pull the big TFR lever. They fired the laser of at who knows what and then FAA lifted the TFR.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#543

Post by nonameiguess »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #380
p-e-w wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the answer. The cartels would have to be insane to poke that particular bear. They would get crushed like a bug. IIRC they murdered a single US undercover officer in the 90s and the retaliation was so bad that they themselves handed over the perpetrators.

> They would get crushed like a bug. Much as I despise them, I'm not so sure that would be the case. I seem to remember folks saying the same about the Taliban, and the cartels have a lot more money and high-tech kit, than the Taliban. Asymmetric warfare is a tough gig, on all sides.

The Taliban was repeatedly crushed. All of the leadership was killed many times over. The problem is the Taliban is an idea that transcends individual human members and it can always be reconstituted. It also benefited from being able to harbor supporters in Pakistan, which is a nuclear power the US was not willing to also invade.

There isn't a real analogy there because cartel leaders have no official state support anywhere, let alone in a bordering nuclear power, but even if they did, it hardly seems reassuring from their perspective to know the drug trade will outlive them after they all get killed. It's different when you're deeply religious and believe what you're doing is worth dying for and the larger arc of history is more important than your own life and wellbeing. I don't think drug lords think that way.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#544

Post by quickthrowman »

bpodgursky wrote: post #361
Eddy_Viscosity2 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even Cartels know that shooting down civilian aircraft in US airspace would be an escalation that would lead to heavy retaliation. Doesn't seem likely to me.

Yes that might be the high-level logic, but if you give a MANPAD to a 19 year old sicario on meth, accidents do happen.

I’d be surprised if cartels would tolerate hard drug use by their soldiers, it seems like the kind of thing they’d kill you for, lack of discipline.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#545

Post by ErroneousBosh »

jacquesm wrote: post #532
lysace wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fox News first reported that the airborne object was intercepted after raising concerns of a potential drone operating near the southern border. Officials later concluded the object was not an unmanned aircraft but a party balloon, a U.S. official told the outlet. https://www.foxnews.com/politics/us-military-shot-down-party... US military shot down party balloon near El Paso after drone suspicion, official says Would…

Just think about the terrorist potential here. Buy a $10 party balloon, let it go near a major airport and they'll panic and shut down the airport. That's a lot of havoc for a couple of bucks.

Hast du etwas Zeit für mich?

Dann singe ich ein Lied für dich

Von 99 Luftballons

Auf ihrem Weg zum ... well, El Paso as it turns out.

the English rewrite of course starts:

You and I in a little toyshop

Buy a bag of balloons with the money we've got

Set them free at the break of dawn

'til one by one, they were gone...

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#546

Post by dlcarrier »

hshdhdhj4444 wrote: post #435
nkrisc wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Charitably guessing that if they don't know how long they'll need to keep airspace closed then you give yourself plenty of time and rescind early if necessary, as opposed to continually issuing extensions which could cause confusion.

Or you say “until further notice”. Indeterminate end dates are not a new problem.

They don't have a mechanism for doing that. A military base near me has had continuous flight restrictions for decades. Each notice lasts a few months (e.g. https://tfr.faa.gov/tfr3/?page=detail_5_8746) and before it expires they issue a new one.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#547

Post by array_key_first »

Nathanael_M wrote: post #117

The percentage of comments written primarily for the purpose irrational political ranting is frustrating, considering the genuinely interesting nature of the story.

It's not irrational to assume current statements from this particular government are not true. If anything, it's irrational to just believe what you're told. We're well past the point where lies outnumber truths, so if you're a betting man, you should assume what you've been told is not true.

The speculation, however, is just that. But, I think we all understand that the reason this was done is not for the reasons stated, and there is something else going on that we are not privy to.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#548

Post by CamperBob2 »

influx wrote: post #407
sowbug wrote: post #392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the US wanted to end the fentanyl and xylazine and nitazene epidemic, it would legalize the controlled manufacture, sale, and usage of the drugs being adulterated. This won't happen, because the 50-year-old War on Drugs is a load-bearing pillar of the US government.

I live in Seattle, decriminalizing drugs didn't turn out that way here.

Decriminalizing public intoxication didn't turn out to be a good idea.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#549

Post by cucumber3732842 »

jacquesm wrote: post #532
lysace wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fox News first reported that the airborne object was intercepted after raising concerns of a potential drone operating near the southern border. Officials later concluded the object was not an unmanned aircraft but a party balloon, a U.S. official told the outlet. https://www.foxnews.com/politics/us-military-shot-down-party... US military shot down party balloon near El Paso after drone suspicion, official says Would…

Just think about the terrorist potential here. Buy a $10 party balloon, let it go near a major airport and they'll panic and shut down the airport. That's a lot of havoc for a couple of bucks.

>Just think about the terrorist potential here. Buy a $10 party balloon, let it go near a major airport and they'll panic and shut down the airport. That's a lot of havoc for a couple of bucks.

And rather than see the government have egg on face people (probably a majority here) will vote for politicians who promise all sorts of licenses and regulations on balloons because of it and then in 20yr when I complain and remind them that once upon a time every store used to sell balloons with no KYC BS they'll act like I'm some sort of barbarian, screech, wring their hands, clutch their pearls, etc.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#550

Post by array_key_first »

graemep wrote: post #124
baq wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You aren’t, probably was flagged down by not being hacker enough (or more likely for being an open invitation to runaway speculation without any grounding in reality and facts)

This also seems to be an open invitation to runaway speculation. A lot of the speculation is ridiculous given only a small area has been closed. That is not a prelude to war, for example!

The last time anything even close to this has happened was 9/11. Lately, we have been living in times that are more often unprecedented. But, do not let that desensitize you. This was not business as usual. This was extremely strange. Things like this only happen in times of War. Why are they happening now?
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