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Claude Code is being dumbed down?

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Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#351

Post by bradfa »

noupdates wrote: post #43
bradfa wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes and no. There are many not-trivial things you have to solve when using an LLM to help (or fully handle writing) code. For example, applying diffs to files. Since the LLM uses tokenization for all its text input/output, sometimes the diffs it'll create to modify a file aren't quite right as it may slightly mess up the text which is before/after the change and/or might introduce a slight typo in text which is being…

I'm part of the subset of developers that was not trained in Machine Learning, so I can't actually code up an LLM from scratch (yet). Some of us are already behind with AI. I think not getting involved in the foundational work of building coding agents will only leave more developers left in the dust. We have to know how these things work in and out. I'm only willing to deal with one black box at the moment, and that…

You don't need to understand how the model works internally to make an agentic coding tool. You just need to understand how the APIs work to interface with the model and then comprehend how the model behaves given different prompts so you can use it effectively to get things done. No Machine Learning previous experience necessary.

Start small, hit issues, fix them, add features, iterate, just like any other software.

There's also a handful of smaller open source agentic tools out there which you can start from, or just join their community, rather than writing your own.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#352

Post by myko »

I really hate this change. I had just given a demo about how Claude Code helped me learn some things by showing exactly what it was doing, and now it doesn't do that any more. So frustrating.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#354

Post by akdev1l »

massysett wrote: post #291
pbasista wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The below remark is unrelated to the main topic of this thread. Why would you even watch a YouTube video with ads? There are ad blockers, sponsor segment blockers, etc. If you use them, it will block almost every kind of YouTube ad.

I used to use ad blockers. One day I visited DistroWatch.com. The site deliberately tweaked its images so ad blockers would block some "good" images. It took me awhile to figure out what was going on. The site freely admitted what it was doing. The site's point was: you're looking at my site, which I provide for free, yet you block the thing that lets me pay for the site? I stopped using ad blockers after that. If a…

Not safe, before even knowing if a site has the content you want you can be redirected to malware through ad networks

not even joking

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#355

Post by dasil003 »

mlinsey wrote: post #320
alphazard wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Product management might be the worst meme in the industry. Hire people who have never used the product and don't think like or accurately represent our users, then let them allocate engineering resources and gate what ships. What could go wrong? It should be a fad gone by at this point, but people never learn. Here's what to do instead: Find your most socially competent engineer, and have them talk to users a couple…

Good PM's are extremely good at understanding users, and use soft-skills to make the rest of the org focus on users more. I've worked with a couple, and they've added an enormous amount of value, sometimes steering teams of dozens of engineers in a more productive direction. The problem is, it's hard to measure how good a PM is, even harder than for engineers. The instinct is to use product KPI's to do so, but especi…

Putting on a PM hat is something I've been doing regularly in my engineering career over the last quarter century. Even as a junior (still in college!) at my first job I was thinking about product, in no small part because there were no PMs in sight. As I grew through multiple startups and eventually bigger brand name tech companies, I realized that understanding how the details work combined with some sense of what users actually want and how they behave is a super power. With AI this skillset has never been more relevant.

I agree your assessment about the value of good PMs. The issue, in my experience, is that only about 20% (at most) are actually good. 60% are fine and can be successful with the right Design and Engingeering partners. And 20% should just be replaced by AI now so we can put the proper guardrails around their opinions and not be misled by their charisma or whatever other human traits enabled them to get hired into a job they are utterly unqualified for.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#356

Post by tetha »

vintagedave wrote: post #117

> That’s it. “Read 3 files.” Which files? Doesn’t matter. “Searched for 1 pattern.” What pattern? Who cares. Product manager here. Cynically, this is classic product management: simplify and remove useful information under the guise of 'improving the user experience' or perhaps minimalism if you're more overt about your influences. It's something that as an industry we should be over by now. It requires deep understa…

We are currently extremely blessed on the companies new product, because they have placed a curious and open-minded product manager and a curious and open-minded ux-designer in charge of the administrative interface. Over half a year, those two have gained the trust of several admins within the company, all of them with experience of more than 10 years.

We have by now taught them about good information density.

Like, the permission pages, if you look at them just once, kinda look like bad 90s UIs. They throw a crapton of information at you.

But they contain a lot of smart things you only realize when actually using it from an admin perspective. Easy comparison of group permissions by keeping sorting orders and colors stable, so you can toggle between groups and just visually match what's different, because colors change. Highlights of edge cases here and there. SSO information around there as well. Loads of frontloaded necessary info with optional information behind various places.

You can move seriously fast in that interface once you understand it.

Parts of the company hate it for not being user friendly. I just got a mail that a customer admin was able to setup SSO in 15 minutes and debug 2 mapping issues in another 10 and now they are production ready.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#357

Post by Der_Einzige »

minimaxir wrote: post #29
co_king_3 wrote: post #5

Am I mistaken or is Claude Code essentially an opt-in rootkit?

Modern agenting coding software is scoped to only allow edits in the project folder, with some sandboxing more aggressively than others (Claude Code the most)

Don't lie. The correct way to run it is with sudo su - then IS_SANDBOX=1 claude code --dangerously-skip-permissions

This is the true AI pilled version.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#358

Post by FergusArgyll »

turnsout wrote: post #244
turnsout wrote: post #30

As a heavy CC user, I appreciate a cleaner console output. If you really need to know which 3 files CC read, AI-assisted coding agents might not be for you.

Downvoted, but fight me on this… It's important to see what it wrote, but what it read?

If there's obviously important context in foo and I see that it didn't read foo then I know that means it's making assumptions which are wrong

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#359

Post by taude »

pbasista wrote: post #156
taude wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't watch a YouTube video without seeing a Claude ad. Same for friends. Safe for non-programmer friends.

The below remark is unrelated to the main topic of this thread. Why would you even watch a YouTube video with ads? There are ad blockers, sponsor segment blockers, etc. If you use them, it will block almost every kind of YouTube ad.

all the ad blockers I used to use stop working, and it became an annoying game of cat and mouse that I didn't have time for. Luckily, most of the time I can "skip" the ad in like five seconds, and it gives me a moment to catch up on incoming Slack messages.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#360

Post by nektro »

svnt wrote: post #325

They don’t seem to realize that doing vibe coding requires enough information to get the vibes. There are no vibes in “I am looking at files and searching for things” so I have zero weight to assign to your decision quality up until the point where it tells me the evals passed at 100%. Your agent is not good enough. I trust it like I trust a toddler not to fall into a swimming pool. It’s not trying to, but enough tim…

the definition of vibe coding is that you never check what it's doing, you only check its output; eg the actual website/feature you're having it build.
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