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Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

nytimes.com

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Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#341

Post by reactordev »

infecto wrote: post #257
reactordev wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cartels only strike their own on US soil…

You’re missing the point. Absolutely cartel violence impacts all types of people in the US and Mexico but large scale brutal violence that is usually saved for Mexico since unfortunately the Mexican federal government does not have control in most of the regions. There is a huge difference between a one off gang killing in the US and someone taking a whole grey hound bus and burying the bodies in the desert.

Which is why I bring up their affinity for going after busses of people, because they have, in Mexico…

The world does not stop at the Us border.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#342

Post by mmh0000 »

BoredPositron wrote: post #287
p-e-w wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the answer. The cartels would have to be insane to poke that particular bear. They would get crushed like a bug. IIRC they murdered a single US undercover officer in the 90s and the retaliation was so bad that they themselves handed over the perpetrators.

You are right rationality is their strongest character trait.

I would recommend reading the Freakinomics book or listen to their podcasts on drugs.

TL;DR: drug cartels are run like businesses. They are very rational. But, unlike your boss, their boss can also shoot you in the face if you annoy them too much

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#343

Post by jjtheblunt »

lingrush4 wrote: post #332
ahhhhnoooo wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Closing a small patch of airspace while military activity is occurring is not authoritarianism. Get a grip you lunatic

i think the comment you replied to said what you said

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#344

Post by 542354234235 »

BoredPositron wrote: post #287
p-e-w wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the answer. The cartels would have to be insane to poke that particular bear. They would get crushed like a bug. IIRC they murdered a single US undercover officer in the 90s and the retaliation was so bad that they themselves handed over the perpetrators.

You are right rationality is their strongest character trait.

How are they not rational? Violence is a tool. They operate an illegal business so they can’t sue other parties for breach of contract. They can't call the police if they are robbed or file an insurance claim for what was taken. Even the over-the-top violence has a rationale. They aren't punishing the victims as much as they are attempting to broadcast that there is a higher price to be paid than any gain from giving information, to reduce their future losses and enforcement efforts. It isn’t moral or ethical, but I wouldn’t say it is irrational.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#345

Post by unethical_ban »

diogenes_atx wrote: post #335
lingrush4 wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump needs to be impeached immediately for this. How dare he close airspace and then just lift that closure once the danger has passed.

What danger?

What kind of government would use their statutory authority to shut down an airport when there is a risk to the planes?

Why do you think the FAA doesn't have this authority? Or, why do you think the FAA shouldn't have this authority?

In other words: This may have been needed but poorly executed; this may have been incompetent planning and response. But I wouldn't call the FAA shutting down an airport "police state".

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#346

Post by diogenes_atx »

unethical_ban wrote: post #345
diogenes_atx wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What danger?

What kind of government would use their statutory authority to shut down an airport when there is a risk to the planes? Why do you think the FAA doesn't have this authority? Or, why do you think the FAA shouldn't have this authority? In other words: This may have been needed but poorly executed; this may have been incompetent planning and response. But I wouldn't call the FAA shutting down an airport "police state".

>> What kind of government would use their statutory authority to shut down an airport when there is a risk to the planes?

It could be either an incompetent government or an authoritarian government that is trying to militarize certain institutions of civilian life.

>> Why do you think the FAA doesn't have this authority? Or, why do you think the FAA shouldn't have this authority?

The FAA does indeed have the authority. The question is simply: why did the FAA choose to exercise its authority in this case? If there was a real danger to the public, then the FAA should be honest with the people and tell them what is the danger. That is what citizens should expect from a democratic government.

>> This may have been needed but poorly executed; this may have been incompetent planning and response. But I wouldn't call the FAA shutting down an airport "police state".

The reason why I ask if this is an example of police state behavior is because in this case the government apparently took drastic measures without explaining to the people why it was doing so.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#347

Post by tw04 »

beAbU wrote: post #95
lazide wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mexico isn’t going to start a war with the US. it would last a week at most, and they’d end up glowing even more than if the us ‘downwinded’ them all year.

That's exactly what russia thought before invading the Ukraine.

Not to be pedantic but it’s just Ukraine. It is an independent country.

Russia calls is “the Ukraine” because they think it’s their territory and not an independent nation.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#348

Post by GJim »

input_sh wrote: post #278
spaceywilly wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hanlon’s Razor "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." Someone probably just screwed up

You don't screw up something this major, it doesn't happen by accident nor by incompetence. They had plans to bomb something south of that airport, they had to postpone those plans now that the info is public enough that whatever their target was is definitely aware of those plans.

> You don't screw up something this major

Liz Truss begs to differ.

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#349

Post by [deleted] »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #312
wavemode wrote: post #46

If there were some mundane reason for the shutdown (e.g. ATC staffing, or volcanic ash) it wouldn't be a secret, and if there were an emergency (one severe enough to ground all aircraft for so song) we would've heard or seen something. Occam's Razor says, this order came down from Trump. If that's the case, only question remaining would be what is he planning.

Well, if the only comparable antecedent is closing American airspace after 9/11, and that order came down from Bush, it seems reasonable to suppose that this order came down from Trump. As for why? No clue.

[deleted]

Re: Officials Claim Drone Incursion Led to Shutdown of El Paso Airport

#350

Post by resters »

reactordev wrote: post #185
Eddy_Viscosity2 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even Cartels know that shooting down civilian aircraft in US airspace would be an escalation that would lead to heavy retaliation. Doesn't seem likely to me.

Coming from groups that just pickup busses of people to murder, I wouldn’t be so sure that firing back at the US would be out of the question.

who are we (the US)? People who wantonly murder people on fishing boats, etc.
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