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GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

z.ai

71–80 of 540 posts

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#71
post #5

It's looking like we'll have Chinese OSS to thank for being able to host our own intelligence, free from the whims of proprietary megacorps. I know it doesn't make financial sense to self-host given how cheap OSS inference APIs are now, but it's comforting not being beholden to anyone or requiring a persistent internet connection for on-premise intelligence. Didn't expect to go back to macOS but they're basically the…

>...free from the whims of proprietary megacorps

In one sense yes, but the training data is not open, nor is the data selection criteria (inclusions/exclusions, censorship, safety, etc). So we are still subject to the whims of someone much more powerful that ourselves.

The good thing is that open weights models can be finetuned to correct any biases that we may find.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#72
post #39

- meh, i asked what happened to Virginia Guiffre and it told me that she's alive and well living with her husband and children in australia - i pointed out that she died on 2025 and then it told me that my question was a prank with a gaslighting tone because that date is 11 months into the future - it never tried to search the internet for updated knowledge even though the toggle was ON. - all other AI competitors ge…

That's not really an issue exclusive to GLM. Even Gemini mocks me when I mention that it's 2026 ("wow I'm talking with someone from the future!")

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#73

[flagged]

As I promised earlier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46781777

"I will save this for the future, when people complain about Chinese open models and tell me: But this Chinese LLM doesn't respond to question about Tianmen square."

Please stop using Tianmen question as an example to evaluate the company or their models: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46779809

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#74
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea how an LLM company can make any argument that their use of content to train the models is allowed that doesn't equally apply to the distillers using an LLM output. "The distilled LLM isn't stealing the content from the 'parent' LLM, it is learning from the content just as a human would, surely that can't be illegal!"...

The argument is that converting static text into an LLM is sufficiently transformative to qualify for fair use, while distilling one LLM's output to create another LLM is not. Whether you buy that or not is up to you, but I think that's the fundamental difference.

The whole notion of 'distillation' at a distance is extremely iffy anyway. You're just training on LLM chat logs, but that's nowhere near enough to even loosely copy or replicate the actual model. You need the weights for that.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#75
post #5

It's looking like we'll have Chinese OSS to thank for being able to host our own intelligence, free from the whims of proprietary megacorps. I know it doesn't make financial sense to self-host given how cheap OSS inference APIs are now, but it's comforting not being beholden to anyone or requiring a persistent internet connection for on-premise intelligence. Didn't expect to go back to macOS but they're basically the…

> doesn't make financial sense to self-host I guess that's debatable. I regularly run out of quota on my claude max subscription. When that happens, I can sort of kind of get by with my modest setup (2x RTX3090) and quantized Qwen3. And this does not even account for privacy and availability. I'm in Canada, and as the US is slowly consumed by its spiral of self-destruction, I fully expect at some point a digital iron…

Self-hosting training (or gaming) makes a lot of sense, and once you have the hardware self-hosting inference on it is an easy step.

But if you have to factor in hardware costs self-hosting doesn't seem attractive. All the models I can self-host I can browse on openrouter and instantly get a provider who can get great prices. With most of the cost being in the GPUs themselves it just makes more sense to have others do it with better batching and GPU utilization

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#76

[flagged]

The protest was 1989.

Interestingly GLM4.7-flash has no problem talking about it.

Here's the output when I asked about it.

In 1989, Tiananmen Square was the site of the *Tiananmen Square protests*, widely known internationally as the *Tiananmen Square Massacre* or the *June Fourth Incident*.

Here is a summary of the events:

*Causes and Beginning* The protests began on April 15, 1989, following the death of *Hu Yaobang*, a former Communist Party leader known for his relative openness and support for economic reform. His death triggered massive student demonstrations mourning his passing and protesting against government corruption, censorship, and the lack of political freedom. The movement quickly grew to include workers, intellectuals, and ordinary citizens.

*Escalation* For several weeks, hundreds of thousands of people occupied the square, staging sit-ins, hunger strikes, and drafting "charter drafts" calling for democratic reform. On May 13, hundreds of students began a hunger strike in the square. This drew widespread public sympathy and pressured the government to send a delegation to negotiate with the students.

*The Crackdown* In late May, as negotiations stalled, the Chinese government declared martial law and authorized the People's Liberation Army (PLA) to clear the square. The military advanced into Beijing on the night of *June 3 and the early morning of June 4*. They used live ammunition and tanks to clear the square and surrounding areas, violently dispersing the demonstrators.

*Casualties* There is significant disagreement over the death toll. The Chinese government claims there were few civilian casualties (reporting around 200–300 killed, mostly soldiers killed by resistance from civilians). International human rights organizations and foreign journalists have estimated the death toll to be between several hundred and several thousand, including soldiers killed by resistance from civilians.

*Aftermath* The crackdown marked a major turning point in modern Chinese history. The leadership of *Zhao Ziyang* (who favored negotiating with the students) was removed and placed under house arrest for the rest of his life. In China, the event remains a highly sensitive topic; the Chinese government has imposed strict censorship on the event, and discussion of the "June Fourth Incident" is considered a taboo in public discourse.

*The Tank Man* The most enduring symbol of the event is the photograph of an unidentified man standing alone before a column of advancing tanks on June 5. This figure became a global icon of nonviolent resistance.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> doesn't make financial sense to self-host I guess that's debatable. I regularly run out of quota on my claude max subscription. When that happens, I can sort of kind of get by with my modest setup (2x RTX3090) and quantized Qwen3. And this does not even account for privacy and availability. I'm in Canada, and as the US is slowly consumed by its spiral of self-destruction, I fully expect at some point a digital iron…

Self-hosting training (or gaming) makes a lot of sense, and once you have the hardware self-hosting inference on it is an easy step. But if you have to factor in hardware costs self-hosting doesn't seem attractive. All the models I can self-host I can browse on openrouter and instantly get a provider who can get great prices. With most of the cost being in the GPUs themselves it just makes more sense to have others d…

If you can get near 100% utilization for your own GPUs (i.e. you're letting requests run overnight and not insisting on any kind of realtime response) it starts to make sense. OpenRouter doesn't have any kind of batched requests API that would let you leverage that possibility.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#78
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea how an LLM company can make any argument that their use of content to train the models is allowed that doesn't equally apply to the distillers using an LLM output. "The distilled LLM isn't stealing the content from the 'parent' LLM, it is learning from the content just as a human would, surely that can't be illegal!"...

The argument is that converting static text into an LLM is sufficiently transformative to qualify for fair use, while distilling one LLM's output to create another LLM is not. Whether you buy that or not is up to you, but I think that's the fundamental difference.

> The U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit has affirmed a district court ruling that human authorship is a bedrock requirement to register a copyright, and that an artificial intelligence system cannot be deemed the author of a work for copyright purposes

> The court’s decision in Thaler v. Perlmutter,1 on March 18, 2025, supports the position adopted by the United States Copyright Office and is the latest chapter in the long-running saga of an attempt by a computer scientist to challenge that fundamental principle.

I, like many others, believe the only way AI won't immediately get enshittified is by fighting tooth and nail for LLM output to never be copyrightable

https://www.skadden.com/insights/publications/2025/03/appell...

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