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Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

europeanbusinessmagazine.com

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Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#821

Post by carlosjobim »

pimterry wrote: post #230
computomatic wrote: post #7

Most, if not all countries have their own domestic payment systems. This is about cross-border payments within the EU. “Breakup” seems a bit exaggerated considering the % of payment volume which might switch to the new system.

> “Breakup” seems a bit exaggerated considering the % of payment volume which might switch to the new system. Brazil introduced Pix in 2019, it's now the most used payment method for all transactions nationwide, ahead of both cards & cash. India introduced UPI in 2016, it now handles >80% of digital payments there, and handles more transactions a day than Visa does worldwide . It's totally plausible to me that a simi…

> Brazil introduced Pix in 2019, it's now the most used payment method for all transactions nationwide, ahead of both cards & cash.

Is that by volume of transactions or total amount, or both?

Cash transactions can of course only be estimated for this statement.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#822

Post by malthaus »

rjakobsson wrote: post #764

Bitcoin. Swish (Sweden) sees quite a lot of downtime. Why not settle for something that doesn't have these inherent issues that closed, proprietary systems have?

so something that is a horrible store of value, has monumental transaction fees, non-instant confirmation and is associated by laypersons mostly with speculation, fraud & illegal transactions will solve those?

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#823

Post by locknitpicker »

joe_mamba wrote: post #759
pjc50 wrote: post #754

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moreau is apparently a Russian citizen living in Russia since 2013. I have some concerns about process, but not for these guys. People working for enemy intelligence services tend to get treated harshly.

>Moreau is apparently a Russian citizen living in Russia since 2013. Is he not still a French born citizen deserving of a fair trial? Or should getting a dual citizenship of a foreign passport, of a nation that later becomes an adversary, become an automatic death sentence? US should then put all it citizens with Cuban and Iranian passports in jail with that logic. And then what about Jacques BAUD who's Swiss living…

> Or should getting a dual citizenship of a foreign passport, of a nation that later becomes an adversary, become an automatic death sentence?

You seem to be invested in trying to stitch together flimsy arguments based on specious reasoning.

Your so-called victims are Russian agents with Russian nationality which have been engaged directly with a totalitarian regime that is engaged in war across Europe, both cold and hot.

You don't even try to argue for innocence. You know they are agents and guilty, but somehow opt to shift focus to technicalities. Why?

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#824

Post by arein3 »

padjo wrote: post #783
WhyNotHugo wrote: post #520

The irony is that this new payment method has the exact same issue: it's deeply tied to US corporate. Their site claims that it can only be used on iOS or Android: https://support.wero-wallet.eu/hc/en-us/articles/25599074240... Also: > It is not possible to use Wero via a web browser or on a computer. This seems an even worse situation than carrying around a Maestro (mastercard) with me.

It is comical. Exchanging one set of US overlords for another. I suppose it is possible to use a degoogled android but most people won't be doing that.

Not even that. Most banking apps have a requirement that android is "certified" by google, ex. They won't run on GrapheneOS

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#825

Post by scotty79 »

miroljub wrote: post #271
lmz wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

France has CB. Germany has girocard. The entire problem is that these are national and not interoperable across the EU.

I don't know for France, but in Germany, they did everything they could to reduce Girocard usage. Today, every bank offers Visa debit, but if you want Girocard, it's difficult to find a bank that offers it. There's nothing wrong with having national cards, since >90% of transactions are national anyway. That's how German Girocard worked for decades until the coordinated push to switch to Visa Debit happened. And the…

I set up accounts in two different German banks. Both gave me girocard by default. I had to request Visa from one to attach to google wallet. I have no idea how to request Visa from the other bank.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#826

Post by n4r9 »

philipwhiuk wrote: post #816
joe_mamba wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>No one should be required to carry an attacker-controlled tracking device What about being required to carry a your-own-government-controlled tracking device? Because the US or Chine government can't harm me in Europe via the data they collect from me, But the EU authorities can if they want to, so naturally I fear them more if they were the ones hoovering my data. What are the odds they're using this on-shore tech…

> Because the US or Chine government can't harm me in Europe via the data they collect from me That's an amusingly naïve perspective. The US government absolutely can harm you, via a multitude of ways.

Also, Chinese-owned firms are known to be transferring EU citizens' data to China in violation of GDPR: https://noyb.eu/en/tiktok-aliexpress-shein-co-surrender-euro...

China's government has strategic goals to destabilise and weaken the EU, and data-farming will be part of their strategy.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#828

Post by olalonde »

_zagj wrote: post #814
olalonde wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you want to switch the world to a debit-based system where economic transactions are limited by cash on hand, I'd argue that's a poorer and less dynamic world than the one we're operating in today. Disagree. Credit has its uses, but debit is superior for the vast majority consumer transactions: lower fees, lower risk, instant settlement, easy P2P transfers, and broader accessibility. That we've become used to cr…

> lower risk, instant settlement That's ridiculous. Why should I, as a consumer, care about the merchant's "risk?"

You don't have to, that's mostly a benefit for merchants. Although it does translate to lower prices and greater competition.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#829

Post by modo_mario »

bigfudge wrote: post #807
modo_mario wrote: post #725

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is the EU built against that and how does it matter?

The EU is built on rules that uphold liberal democratic principles, agreed to by national governments in a flush of post-WW2 clarity, and which tie successors to the same principles. There are exit mechanisms, but they impose large costs (i.e. Brexit).

You're saying nothing concrete in particular. What rules? How do they inhibit change? The only thing I can think of which is actually difficult to change is the echr and i see more than a dozen mostly liberal governments queueing up to change it (to little effect so far) over migration issues.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#830

Post by distances »

Hikikomori wrote: post #272
SomeUserName432 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would never buy a plane ticket on debit. Airbnb reservations I also tend to do on credit. Anything related to company expenses I also do on credit and receive reimbursement prior to having to pay it myself.

In Europe you typically have travel insurance on debit cards as well.

What? Where? I don't believe this to be common, and have some doubts about this existing anywhere at all.
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