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Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

europeanbusinessmagazine.com

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Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#631

Post by 0xDEAFBEAD »

Esophagus4 wrote: post #179

Sigh The fact that EU sees dependence on American tech in the same way as Russian oil now is saddening and telling. Americans and American companies had it really good - our tech extracted money from the world, and they were mostly willing to pay for it. And it was an incredible advantage to the US. But now, it seems that we are happily throwing all that away, for what benefit I do not yet see. Regardless of whether…

The Europeans spent years scolding us for being warmongers. Then when Ukraine got invaded, they quickly switched to scolding Biden for not warmongering harder in Ukraine. Zero self-awareness.

America was called an "enemy of Europe" (before the Greenland stuff) even though it was more generous towards Ukraine than a bunch of European countries, and essentially every country outside of Europe. Polls showed that China has higher approval than the US in Europe, despite the fact that China actively supplies war material to Russia. Again, this was before the Greenland stuff (I'm against that obviously).

There's no point in trying to please these people. They regard us as a vassal state. They're not joking when they say they think of Americans as idiots. We should've withdrawn from NATO a long time ago. Hopefully Europe's corporate boycotts will help to pass Massie's withdrawal bill.

It will also be interesting to see drug prices in Europe rise after the Europeans spent years making fun of the US for high drug prices. https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2026/02/tr...

The Europeans tend to reap what they sow in the US/Europe relationship.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#632

Post by weddpros »

ekjhgkejhgk wrote: post #8

I always find it entertaining to hear people try to argue that what these companies do is soooooo difficult and that's why they're valuable. It's just multiple computers keeping a balance. It's not complicated. No, these companies keep themselves in power not because they've solved such a difficult problem that nobody else can, but because they have a moat which they protect. Time to do away with these foreign entiti…

Hosted on Amazon and Digital Ocean from what I can tell

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#633

Post by socceroos »

severino wrote: post #135

Whatever they come up with, I hope it doesn't tie you to a Google or Apple smartphone. Can't we have cards for this? In Spain, for example, to use Bizum, you need either an Android/iOS smartphone (and for the Android case, as you use it from your bank's app, it would typically require some Google security assurances - so no Huawei phones allowed, for example) or logging into your bank's website and use Bizum from the…

I hope they go with Taler, personally. Privacy of cash but the required traceability for merchants.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#634

Post by ahefner »

joe_mamba wrote: post #316
digiown wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is really a human right issue. No one should be required to carry an attacker-controlled tracking device, especially not for interacting with the government. It's funny that the EU uses all this mobile attestation BS more than the US does. So much for sovereignty and consumer protection. No monopoly Google can build is as good as the government forcing you to accept their terms.

>No one should be required to carry an attacker-controlled tracking device What about being required to carry a your-own-government-controlled tracking device? Because the US or Chine government can't harm me in Europe via the data they collect from me, But the EU authorities can if they want to, so naturally I fear them more if they were the ones hoovering my data. What are the odds they're using this on-shore tech…

Every government is an attacker.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#635

Post by altcognito »

teh_infallible wrote: post #604
the_fall wrote: post #577

Earlier quoted context omitted.

35 years ago, a good chunk of the current EU was under a Soviet-imposed totalitarian rule. Spain was a dictatorship until 1975. And it's been just 80 years since WWII. It always boggles my mind that most Europeans are absolutely convinced that nothing like that could ever happen again. Meanwhile, many people in the US are convinced that the government will be coming for them any minute now.

[flagged]

They who and what?

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#636

Post by literallywho »

hirako2000 wrote: post #618
ginko wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Qr apps just sound cumbersome compared to contactless tap to pay.

Contactless is the convenience provided to get us into some wall garden. Apple pay. Google pay. Samsung pay. These are not open or interchangeable standard, they aren't interested in that. They want our valuable transactional data, and location when those are made. QR codes are a standard. It allows any bank to issue funds. It's a wire transfer. Transfer are a standard. Any bank can adopt it. Typically a bank adopts…

Yeah, but... QR codes are annoying. I live in Thailand and I have to scan them every day. Pretty much every time, I wish it was as seamless as Apple Pay.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#637

Post by poilcn »

fhdkweig wrote: post #233
severino wrote: post #135

Whatever they come up with, I hope it doesn't tie you to a Google or Apple smartphone. Can't we have cards for this? In Spain, for example, to use Bizum, you need either an Android/iOS smartphone (and for the Android case, as you use it from your bank's app, it would typically require some Google security assurances - so no Huawei phones allowed, for example) or logging into your bank's website and use Bizum from the…

> Whatever they come up with, I hope it doesn't tie you to a Google or Apple smartphone. I would also hope so, that is the entire point. The reason they are scrambling right now is because Starlink just shut off all of Russia. Because Starlink was so cheap and easy (and stable for the last 4 years of the war), a lot of people in Russia stopped using any other form of internet access. And while all of Europe is happy…

What are you talking about, 92% of Russian population has access to internet via landlines, the government subsidised building all the infustructre. The internet access is one of the cheapest in the world($5-10 per month for 100-500mbit/s), starlink with its $50-120 price tag is not affordable at all, ignoring the fact it doesn't even work here

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#639

Post by usr1106 »

Saline9515 wrote: post #404
maigret wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually European integration the last 30 years has been pretty remarkable. In the past, not even electric plugs were compatible. But the EU is not a country. A lot of the inefficiencies are actually features sought by key members to protect their own local incumbents.

Your best example of European integration is electric plugs?

Money transfers between bank accounts for no extra fees (well, that's limited to the Euro, so a couple of countries chose to stay outside). Mobile phone usage for no extra fees all over EU (some limitations, but typically not relevant for the average trip).

B2B the integration has even bigger impact.

I don't think eletric plugs are even regulated. British plugs never changed and they were not an argument in Brexit.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#640

Post by usr1106 »

Semaphor wrote: post #627
moffkalast wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SEPA would be a decent solution with instant QR code generation and app payments, but the transfer fees are ludicrous for daily use (~1-2€ per wire). Or maybe it's just my bank being greedy fucks as usual.

Huh, I thought the EU had mandated for instant SEPA transfers to be free. Maybe it’s just national. What country are you in?

Of course there is no mandate to offer anything for free. They just need to be offered for the same price as other methods.

But most people have a bank account for a fixed price and some even for free. So individual transfers are considered free, even if the correct term would be "already paid".

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