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I started programming when I was 7. I'm 50 now and the thing I loved has changed

jamesdrandall.com

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Re: I started programming when I was 7. I'm 50 now and the thing I loved has changed

#321

Post by tavavex »

alt227 wrote: post #110
abraxas wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For example wood carvers, blacksmiths, butchers, bakers, candlestickmakers etc etc. Very, very few of those professions are thriving. Especially if we are talking true craftsmanship and not stuffing the oven with frozen pastries to create the smell and the corresponding illusion of artisinal work.

They are thriving where I live. There is a huge artisinal market for hand crafted things. There are many markets, craft centers, art fairs, regular classes from professionals teaching amateurs etc. In most rural communities I have visited it is similar.

They're existing, not really thriving. Artisanal things have become more popular as a hobby, but even people who get into them commercially rarely make real money off of it. The demand exists, but purely as a novelty for people who appreciate those types of things, or perhaps in really niche sub-markets that aren't adequately covered by big businesses. But the artisans aren't directly competing with companies that provide similar goods to them at scale, because it's simply impossible. They've just carved out a niche and sell the experience or the tailoring of what they're making to the small slice of the population who's willing to pay for that.

You can't do this with software. Non-devs don't understand nor appreciate any qualities of software beyond the simplest comprehension of UX. There's no such thing as "hand-made" software. 99% of people don't care about what runs on their computer at all, they only care about the ends, not the means. As long as it appears to do what you want, it's good enough, and good enough is all that's needed by everyone.

Re: I started programming when I was 7. I'm 50 now and the thing I loved has changed

#323

Post by chasd00 »

FeteCommuniste wrote: post #129
qalmakka wrote: post #119

I am much younger than the author, but I've been coding for most of my life and I find close to no joy in using AIs. For me coding has always been about the nitty-gritty quirkiness of computers, languages, solving issues and writing new cool things for the sake of it. It was always more about the journey than the end goal, and AI basically hollows out all of the interesting bits about coding. It feels like skipping s…

> For me coding has always been about the nitty-gritty quirkiness of computers, languages, solving issues and writing new cool things for the sake of it. Same. It scratches my riddle-solving itch in a way that the process of "prompt-honing" has yet to do.

for me, and i bet many people, the only riddles being solved (at least at work) for the last few years amount to "what is eslint complaining about now?". It's nice not to have to eff with things like that and other aggravations anymore by offloading it to an agent.

Re: I started programming when I was 7. I'm 50 now and the thing I loved has changed

#324

Post by nprz »

sho_hn wrote: post #14

My advice to everyone feeling existential vertigo over these tools is to remain confident and trust in yourself. If you were a smart dev before AI, chances are you will remain a smart dev with AI. My experience so far is that to a first approximation, the quality of the code/software generated with AI corresponds to the quality of the developer using the AI tool surprisingly well. An inexperienced, bad dev will still…

I think there is more existential fear that is left unaddressed.

Most commenters in this thread seem to be under the impression that where the agents are right now is where they will be for a while, but will they? And for how long?

$660 billion is expected to be spent on AI infrastructure this year. If the AI agents are already pretty good, what will the models trained in these facilities be capable of?

Re: I started programming when I was 7. I'm 50 now and the thing I loved has changed

#325

Post by Joel_Mckay »

woah wrote: post #317
Joel_Mckay wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem very passionate about your opinions, but are you happy? The fact remains LLM can't reach comparable human error rates without consuming 75% of the energy output of our entire local galaxy. While I find true Neuromorphic computing topics more interesting, the emergence of the LLM "AI" true believer is deeply concerning to those that understand how they are actually built. =3 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ER…

I just had an AI write a toy game engine with realistic camera and lens simulation on the view from scratch in rust in one day while i was working on other stuff all for the price of a $20/month Cursor subscription

"AI" LLM don't write anything, but copied someones symbolic isomorphic work that could fit the expected definition in the reasoning model.

Like all copyright submarines, your firm now runs the non-zero risk someone will sue for theft, or hit the product with a DMCA claim. What is the expected value of piracy versus actual business. =3

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MalBJuI9O5k

Re: I started programming when I was 7. I'm 50 now and the thing I loved has changed

#326

Post by nlawalker »

mosburger wrote: post #177
samiv wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just told my gardener to cut the grass and work on some flower installations. I'm so excited about gardening again. Can't wait to do some. Employing a gardener to do my gardening for me is really making me enjoy gardening again!

this is a great analogy despite it possibly coming off as snark. I think it's hard for some people to grasp that programmers are motivated by different things. Some are motivated by shipping products to users, others are motivated to make code that's a giant elegant cathedral, still others love glorious hacks to bend the machine into doing things it was never really intended to do. And I'm sure I'm missing a few othe…

I don't disagree, but I think it would benefit everyone to be clear, upfront and honest with themselves and others about exactly what's being lost and grieved. The weeds are still growing and our hands are still available to pull them, so it's not that.

Re: I started programming when I was 7. I'm 50 now and the thing I loved has changed

#328

Post by chasd00 »

zero_shift wrote: post #74

I don't disagree that technology is less fun in an AI era. The question is, what other careers are out there for someone who wants to make things? About a decade ago, I went through a career crisis where I couldn't decide what job to do - whether technology was really the best choice for my particular temperament and skills. Law? Too cutthroat. Civil service? Very bureaucratic. Academia? Bad pay. Journalism? An indus…

> who's willing to learn new things.

I tell my boys, get good at learning and you don't have to get good at anything else. I think that still holds now as much as ever.

Re: I started programming when I was 7. I'm 50 now and the thing I loved has changed

#329

Post by tavavex »

dgacmu wrote: post #134
raphman wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author admits that they used AI but I found it not that obvious. What are telltale signs in this case? While the writing style is a little bit over-stylized (exactly three examples in a sentence, Blade Runner reference), I might write in a similar style about a topic that im very emotional about. The actual content feels authentic to me.

(1) The pattern "It's not just a X---It's a Y" is super common in LLM-generated text for some reason. Complete with em dash. (I like em dashes and I wish LLMs weren't ruining them for the rest of us) "Upgrading your CPU wasn’t a spec sheet exercise — it was transformative." "You weren’t just a user. You were a systems engineer by necessity." "The tinkerer spirit didn’t die of natural causes — it was bought out and pu…

> And .. more. It's like the LLM latched on to things that were locally "interesting" writing, but applies them globally, turning the entire thing into a soup of "ah-ha! hey! here!" completely ignorant of the terrible harm it does to the narrative structure and global readability of the piece.

It's like YouTube-style engagement maximization. Make it more punchy, more rapid, more impactful, more dramatic - regardless of how the outcome as a whole ends up looking.

I wonder if this writing style is only relevant to ChatGPT on default settings, because that's the model that I've heard people accuse the most of doing this. Do other models have different repetitive patterns?

Re: I started programming when I was 7. I'm 50 now and the thing I loved has changed

#330

Post by probably_wrong »

tndibona wrote: post #43
gustavopezzi wrote: post #29

Thank you for writing this. My feelings are very similar to the ones described by the author and the timeline almost matches. The thrill of tecnology for me started to fast decay since the early 2010s and now I see it as a no-return stage. I still have fun with my retro hardware & software but I am no longer an active practitioner and I have pivoted my attention and my efforts somewhere else. Unfortunately, I no long…

What else do you do to make rent ? I feel the same way as you and I have no idea what else pays well for quality craftsmanship. I am staring at the abyss of hyper intelligent people with posh resumes and now wondering what to do.

According to his profile, he teaches CS and Math.
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